Archive 2017-2019 Political Thread

[JayF]

Typically the house judiciary committee performs an investigation. Then the house passes articles of impeachment.

Yes the House Judiciary Committee can and should perform an investigation. As should the Senate and if needed an independent counsel. But notice that didn't start with Impeachment. Even in your own words you said Investigation. So lets investigate and if there is sufficient evidence that he tried to use Public money to instigate an investigation into Biden's son, then by all means, lets start the impeachment process, but it needs to be handled correctly. The appearance Nancy Pelosi and the House Democrats are giving off though is one of the Cart Before the Horse and impeaching off of hearsay and not an investigation which could lead to the American Public believing that their sole purpose of Impeachment is retaliation or dislike of his political stance.

 

[gangstonc]

Yes the House Judiciary Committee can and should perform an investigation. As should the Senate and if needed an independent counsel. But notice that didn't start with Impeachment. Even in your own words you said Investigation. So lets investigate and if there is sufficient evidence that he tried to use Public money to instigate an investigation into Biden's son, then by all means, lets start the impeachment process, but it needs to be handled correctly. The appearance Nancy Pelosi and the House Democrats are giving off though is one of the Cart Before the Horse and impeaching off of hearsay and not an investigation which could lead to the American Public believing that their sole purpose of Impeachment is retaliation or dislike of his political stance.

I don't think Pelosi is calling for an immediate vote on articles of impeachment. I think she is calling for an inquiry. I could be mistaken. I can't stand to hear her speak.

 

[KoD]

It's not like impeachment has come out of nowhere, this is a culmination of all the problems out of the Trump administration. There's political bias in all of these events and proceedings, but there's been very real federal laws broken, prosecuted and jail time for several close to the president. It's absurd to say this is all politics and no substance. Investigations don't happen unless there's action to investigate - and that's what this impeachment inquiry is. A move to investigate further.
We don't know the whistleblower complaint over "multiple actions" as it's been withheld from Congress which itself is legally required. Democrats didn't force a whistleblower complaint. They learned about it like we did and want to know what it's about.

 

[JayF]

It's not like impeachment has come out of nowhere, this is a culmination of all the problems out of the Trump administration. There's political bias in all of these events and proceedings, but there's been very real federal laws broken, prosecuted and jail time for several close to the president. It's absurd to say this is all politics and no substance. Investigations don't happen unless there's action to investigate - and that's what this impeachment inquiry is. A move to investigate further.
We don't know the whistleblower complaint over "multiple actions" as it's been withheld from Congress which itself is legally required. Democrats didn't force a whistleblower complaint. They learned about it like we did and want to know what it's about.

Articles of Impeachment is not an Inquiry. It is an indictment and sets in motion the Senate to hear the case and vote on conviction.

take for example the Impeachment of Bill Clinton. The House did not write up Articles of Impeachment until an investigation showed there was probable cause for a hearing based on his actions.

It is this setup that is just like our criminal court system. A person isn't first charged with a crime by a grand jury before the investigation is even instigated. When will you all admit there has been a witch hunt to impeach Trump since the day he was elected?

 

[Matt]

Can't make this stuff up.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/...kraine-in-may-demanding-it-investigate-trump/

 

[JayF]

Good then we should immediately hold expulsion hearings for U.S. Senators Robert Menendez (D-NJ), Dick Durbin (D-IL), and Patrick Leahy (D-VT)

 

[Matt]

 

[JayF]

By: Hyram F. Suddfluffel, PhD, (Political Science)

I have a degree in Political Science, and I am a card-carrying Libertarian. I've been studying politics and political history for the past 30 years. My specialty is U.S. Presidents. That said, I hope that the House of Representatives impeaches Trump. Let me tell you what will happen next!

1. The House can pass articles of impeachment over the objections of the Republicans and refer to the Senate for trial.

2. The Senate will conduct a trial. There will be a vote, and the Republicans will vote unanimously, along with a small number of Democrats, to not convict the President. Legally, it will all be over at that point.

3. However, during the trial, and this is what no one is thinking about right now, the President's attorneys will have the right to subpoena and
question ANYONE THEY WANT! That is different than the special counsel investigation, which was very one-sided. So, during the impeachment trial, we will be hearing testimony from James Comey, Peter Strzok, Lisa Page, Bruce Ohr, Glenn Simpson, Donna Brazille, Eric Holder, Loretta Lynch, Christopher Steele, Hillary Clinton, John Brennan, James Clapper, and a whole host of other participants in this whole sordid affair and the ensuing coverup activities. A lot of dirt will be dug up; a lot of truth will be unveiled. Finger pointing will occur. Deals will start being made, and suddenly, a lot of democrats will start being charged and going to prison. All this, because, remember, the President's team will now, for the first time, have the RIGHT to question all of these people under oath – and they will turn on each other. That is already starting.

4. Lastly, one more thing will happen, the Senate will not convict the President. Nothing will happen to Trump. Most Americans are clueless about political processes, the law, and the Constitution. Most Americans believe that being impeached results in removal from office. They don't understand that phase 2 is a trial in and by the Senate, where he has zero chance of conviction. Remember, the Senate is controlled by Republicans; they will determine what testimony is allowed -- and *everything* will be allowed, including: DNC collusion with the Clinton campaign to fix the election in favor of Hillary, the creation of the Trump dossier, the cover up and destruction of emails that very likely included incriminating information. They will incriminate each other for lying to the FISA court, for spying and wiretapping the Trump campaign, and for colluding with foreign political actors, especially George Soros. After the Senate declines to convict the President, we will have an election, and Trump will win. It will be a backlash against democrat petulance, temper tantrums, hypocrisy and dishonesty. Even minorities will vote for Trump, because, for the first time, they will see that democrats have spent 2+ years focused on maintaining their own power, and not doing anything at all about black murders in Chicago, homelessness, opioids, and other important issues that are actually killing people. And, we will spend the following four years listening to politicians and pundits claim that the whole impeachment was rigged.

So let's move on to impeachment.

 

[Matt]

By: Hyram F. Suddfluffel, PhD, (Political Science)

I have a degree in Political Science, and I am a card-carrying Libertarian. I've been studying politics and political history for the past 30 years. My specialty is U.S. Presidents. That said, I hope that the House of Representatives impeaches Trump. Let me tell you what will happen next!

1. The House can pass articles of impeachment over the objections of the Republicans and refer to the Senate for trial.

2. The Senate will conduct a trial. There will be a vote, and the Republicans will vote unanimously, along with a small number of Democrats, to not convict the President. Legally, it will all be over at that point.

3. However, during the trial, and this is what no one is thinking about right now, the President's attorneys will have the right to subpoena and
question ANYONE THEY WANT! That is different than the special counsel investigation, which was very one-sided. So, during the impeachment trial, we will be hearing testimony from James Comey, Peter Strzok, Lisa Page, Bruce Ohr, Glenn Simpson, Donna Brazille, Eric Holder, Loretta Lynch, Christopher Steele, Hillary Clinton, John Brennan, James Clapper, and a whole host of other participants in this whole sordid affair and the ensuing coverup activities. A lot of dirt will be dug up; a lot of truth will be unveiled. Finger pointing will occur. Deals will start being made, and suddenly, a lot of democrats will start being charged and going to prison. All this, because, remember, the President's team will now, for the first time, have the RIGHT to question all of these people under oath – and they will turn on each other. That is already starting.

4. Lastly, one more thing will happen, the Senate will not convict the President. Nothing will happen to Trump. Most Americans are clueless about political processes, the law, and the Constitution. Most Americans believe that being impeached results in removal from office. They don't understand that phase 2 is a trial in and by the Senate, where he has zero chance of conviction. Remember, the Senate is controlled by Republicans; they will determine what testimony is allowed -- and *everything* will be allowed, including: DNC collusion with the Clinton campaign to fix the election in favor of Hillary, the creation of the Trump dossier, the cover up and destruction of emails that very likely included incriminating information. They will incriminate each other for lying to the FISA court, for spying and wiretapping the Trump campaign, and for colluding with foreign political actors, especially George Soros. After the Senate declines to convict the President, we will have an election, and Trump will win. It will be a backlash against democrat petulance, temper tantrums, hypocrisy and dishonesty. Even minorities will vote for Trump, because, for the first time, they will see that democrats have spent 2+ years focused on maintaining their own power, and not doing anything at all about black murders in Chicago, homelessness, opioids, and other important issues that are actually killing people. And, we will spend the following four years listening to politicians and pundits claim that the whole impeachment was rigged.

So let's move on to impeachment.

Agree 100%!

 

[gangstonc]

Can't make this stuff up.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/...kraine-in-may-demanding-it-investigate-trump/

https://www.foreign.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/5-4-18%20Menendez%20joint%20letter%20to%20General%20Prosecutor%20of%20Ukraine%20on%20Mueller%20investigation.pdf

There's the letter. I have no doubt several dems will end up looking bad in this as well, but I don't think this letter does it. The letter is telling to them to start cooperating with Mueller again.

 

[Kory]

Wow! Someone who uses fact and logic! She’s probably got a higher IQ than most of those people in the room combined.

Yet, all you hear from the gun grabbers is nonsense like “who needs high powered megacapacity clipmags that use super light speed velocity rounds that can tear people to shreds?!”

 

[KoD]

Whistleblower complaint was delivered to Congress. Thus far known reactions are:
Democrat: "deeply disturbing"
Republican: no comment.
Very interesting press conference today too.
National intelligence director threatens to resign if not allowed to speak freely to Congress? Idk what that's about.

The ball is moving fast now.

 

[Kory]

Just two weeks ago, Dems were pushing for Kavanaugh's impeachment over some half baked opinion article that turned out to hold no water. I haven't said anything regarding this whole mess nor do I currently hold an opinion, but the left are becoming the boy who cried wolf.

 

[gangstonc]

Whistleblower complaint was delivered to Congress. Thus far known reactions are:
Democrat: "deeply disturbing"
Republican: no comment.
Very interesting press conference today too.
National intelligence director threatens to resign if not allowed to speak freely to Congress? Idk what that's about.

The ball is moving fast now.

SASSE after reading the whistleblower complaint: “Really troubling things here. Republicans ought not just circle the wagons, and democrats ought not have been using words like impeachment before they knew anything about the actual substance.”

 

[gangstonc]

Do any of you think the memorandum of transcript is actually trump’s dictation of what was said? The Ukrainian President sounds a lot like trump.

 

[Matt]

Whistleblower complaint was delivered to Congress. Thus far known reactions are:
Democrat: "deeply disturbing"
Republican: no comment.
Very interesting press conference today too.
National intelligence director threatens to resign if not allowed to speak freely to Congress? Idk what that's about.

The ball is moving fast now.

Fake news. DNI did not threaten to resign. How often can NYT and WAPO be so wrong and yet have people like you still read and believe what they say.

 

[gangstonc]

Fake news. DNI did not threaten to resign. How often can NYT and WAPO be so wrong and yet have people like you still read and believe what they say.

How often can trump like and have people like you still read an believe what he says?

 

[KoD]

Fake news. DNI did not threaten to resign. How often can NYT and WAPO be so wrong and yet have people like you still read and believe what they say.

You're wrong, I didn't believe it and I added a question mark to convey my suspicions about the headline. Nor did I read the article since WaPo only allows a few free views per month and I'm not paying for that. "People like you" is a very hypocritical thing to say coming from a far right parrot.

 

[Evan]

Look man I don't care what your ideology is, what you believe or don't believe. The fact is per the United States Constitution that you cannot prosecute someone just because. You must have evidence, facts, and/or witnesses to back it up. I don't care if you like the President or not, you don't do this for political reasons.

Section 4. of Article II of the Constitution Reads:
Section 4. The President, Vice President and all civil officers of the United States, shall be removed from office on impeachment for, and conviction of, treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors.

There is no evidence of anything, so what are they holding impeachment proceedings for?

The constitution is silent on what evidence is required for impeachment and it doesn't define what bad acts are required for impeachment to be used. Impeachment is a political process. It is part of the checks and balances that solely reside in the hands of Congress. No judge or executive branch member can do anything to stop or overturn an impeachment. A President can be impeached for anything and no evidence is required to do so.

 

[Evan]

Wrong Man I wish you all knew the Constitution. First the Congress, (not just the House) Investigates whatever the allegations may be.

Then if the allegations are founded then the House passes Articles of Impeachment.

Please go read the Constitution. Would you like a Pocket one? I have plenty.

Impeachment doesn't require an investigation or evidence.