• Welcome to TalkWeather!
    We see you lurking around TalkWeather! Take the extra step and join us today to view attachments, see less ads and maybe even join the discussion.
    CLICK TO JOIN TALKWEATHER
Messages
48
Reaction score
14
Location
Byron, CA
While I do believe EF4 was the right call for Winterset, I also feel the wind speed estimate of 170 MPH was too low. At its peak intensity, it swept away an anchor-bolted house and cracked part of its foundation in the process. While the cracked foundation likely resulted from a preexisting weak point known as a 'corner pop', still, foundation damage like this is NOT something I tend to associate with low-end EF4 tornadoes. I don't think the other contextual damage (debarking, scouring, vehicle mangling, etc.) was EF5 worthy but a wind speed estimate around 185-190 MPH would have been more appropriate imo.
030622-gg-winterset-tornado-damage.jpg

Significant_Tornado_Damage_in_Winterset%2C_Iowa_from_March_5%2C_2022.jpg

screenshot_20221109-132010-jpg.15436
Which is why I have mixed feelings about the Enhanced Fujita Scale. Not to slightly criticize the N.W.S., but sometimes, people who are surveying the damage don't look at it closely enough and it gets rated an EF4 when it should've been an EF5 (or at least a High-end EF4)
 
Messages
48
Reaction score
14
Location
Byron, CA
Messages
153
Reaction score
108
Location
Indonesia
The year of 1913 in Nebraska is usually known for the catastrophic outbreak in March. However, 7 months later another violent tornado struck the state, the 10/9/1913 Broken Bow F4 tornado family. This family of tornadoes touched down in Custer County and moved 95 miles into Holt County where it dissipated. The tornado likely was most intense in Custer County. A sod house was destroyed, an entire farm was completely swept away with everything being ground into kindling wood, fence posts were lifted out of the ground and carried for miles, a dozen farmhouses were "wiped from the face of the earth," heavy iron farm machinery was mangled beyond recognition and water tanks were carried 5 miles.
img

img
The image won't load for me
 
Messages
153
Reaction score
108
Location
Indonesia
The violent tornado hit Hunan, China in 1983 spring might be one of the most 'Dixie' tornado outside North America. In records, it is fast with the speed of ~100km/h. It was officially rated as EF4 in recent years and it is probably a QLCS tornado from observing. On Google Earth, the track is about 90km though the tornado weakened and probably lifted for some while in the latter half of the path. This tornado leveled a 1000㎡ brick bungalow courtyard and broke an acient stone tower. The geographic conditions there look similar to that of North AL. And most important thing is that tornado also happened on 4.27. Unluckily, like most of tornadoes in China before 2000, the tornado's survey photos remain buried now.
View attachment 8643View attachment 8644View attachment 8645View attachment 8646
I wonder where did you got those photos
 
Messages
153
Reaction score
108
Location
Indonesia
The highest death toll caused by tornado in single building worldwide is probably the event happened in Huanggang, China on 4/16/1977. At that evening, a QLCS tornado swept hills region near Huanggang. The tornado lifted shrub-sized bamboo with root and threw a 180kg machine to 30 meters away. The F3+ tornado passed a hall in Zongluzui High School. The roof of the hall was lifted and thrown apart and the wall collapsed. Unluckily, 400 students took part in the regional sports meeting at that school that day. When the tornado came, they were watching movie at the hall. 48 students were killed at scene and 38 others died in hospital. This tornado is still a mysterious event. Though there were some article reports, no damage figures has been found yet.
View attachment 9040
View attachment 9041
What's the total fatality (for the school) for the Huanggang tornado?
 

MrTwister

Member
Messages
1
Reaction score
1
Location
Manitoba, Canada
Any information on Southwest tornadoes? I am looking for information on the few F3 tornadoes that have occurred. Events include the 1972 Chino Valley, AZ and 1957 Sentinel, AZ tornadoes. If someone has extra information on these events, please let me know.
 
Last edited:

TH2002

Member
Sustaining Member
Messages
3,188
Reaction score
4,830
Location
California, United States
Special Affiliations
  1. SKYWARN® Volunteer
Any information on Southwest tornadoes? I am looking for information on the few F3 tornadoes that have occurred. Events include the 1972 Chino Valley, AZ and 1957 Sentinel, AZ tornadoes. If someone has extra information on these events, please let me know.
Welcome to the rabbit hole that is "trying to dig up information on obscure tornado events".

For the two events you mentioned, neither is listed as a significant tornado in Thomas Grazulis' book Significant Tornadoes. Instead, one must go back a few months to June 21, 1972, one of the largest outbreaks in Arizona history. Six tornadoes touched down, including an F2 in Phoenix and an F1 (F3 according to Grazulis) in Eloy:
FVvnp2AWUAIOZ2g.jpg


Arizona has had two other EF3 tornadoes, both on October 6, 2010. One passed near Bellemont and was initially rated EF2, being upgraded to EF3 back in 2020. A second passed near Tuba City, flattening a metal electrical transmission tower.
 
Messages
48
Reaction score
14
Location
Byron, CA
Any information on Southwest tornadoes? I am looking for information on the few F3 tornadoes that have occurred. Events include the 1972 Chino Valley, AZ, and 1957 Sentinel, AZ tornadoes. If someone has extra information on these events, please let me know.
On October 6th, 2010, the largest tornado outbreak in the southwestern U.S. occurred. While there were no fatalities and only 7 injuries, there were 4 EF2s and 2 EF3s. One of which was responsible for all 7 tornadic injuries. Officially, the strongest tornado of the outbreak was a High-end EF3 near Tuba City that was responsible for mangling three 500KV transmission towers, one of which was destroyed. However, unofficially, the strongest tornado that was part of the outbreak was a possible EF4 that tore through the east side of Bellemont, AZ. As of 2024, it is officially rated EF2. However, an Instantaneous wind gust of 185 mph was reported by an anemometer. This is the most damning piece of evidence of EF4 intensity associated with the East Bellemont tornado. Still, since it didn't hit anything, the N.W.S. dismissed the anemometer report as irrelevant because the EF-scale is solely and strictly based on damage only. So, the rating was and will still be EF2. Nevertheless, there is no doubt in my mind, that the East Bellemont tornado is a candidate for the strongest twister, and the first and only violent tornado in the Southwestern United States ever recorded. For more, check out this video.
 

WIL9287

Member
Messages
26
Reaction score
94
Location
Brownsville, PA
Special Affiliations
  1. SKYWARN® Volunteer
On October 6th, 2010, the largest tornado outbreak in the southwestern U.S. occurred. While there were no fatalities and only 7 injuries, there were 4 EF2s and 2 EF3s. One of which was responsible for all 7 tornadic injuries. Officially, the strongest tornado of the outbreak was a High-end EF3 near Tuba City that was responsible for mangling three 500KV transmission towers, one of which was destroyed. However, unofficially, the strongest tornado that was part of the outbreak was a possible EF4 that tore through the east side of Bellemont, AZ. As of 2024, it is officially rated EF2. However, an Instantaneous wind gust of 185 mph was reported by an anemometer. This is the most damning piece of evidence of EF4 intensity associated with the East Bellemont tornado. Still, since it didn't hit anything, the N.W.S. dismissed the anemometer report as irrelevant because the EF-scale is solely and strictly based on damage only. So, the rating was and will still be EF2. Nevertheless, there is no doubt in my mind, that the East Bellemont tornado is a candidate for the strongest twister, and the first and only violent tornado in the Southwestern United States ever recorded. For more, check out this video.

The EF scale is based on 3-second gusts. As noted in the Tornado Talk article I wrote on the event, that same anemometer recorded a 3-second gust of 115 mph. The tree damage that occurred outside of the burn scar that the anemometer was in was consistent with other EF-2 tornadoes with winds in the 115-120 mph range. The EF-2 rating for that tornado was perfectly fine. https://www.tornadotalk.com/arizona-tornado-outbreak-october-6-2010/
 
Messages
48
Reaction score
14
Location
Byron, CA

TH2002

Member
Sustaining Member
Messages
3,188
Reaction score
4,830
Location
California, United States
Special Affiliations
  1. SKYWARN® Volunteer

Not your fault @SpotlightForRareTornadoes, and even TornadoTalk has the video labeled wrong (pinging @WIL9287), but I wish people would stop passing around that footage of a 2009 tornado in Brazil as the Tuba City tornado. There's also a modified photograph of a 2003 Nebraska tornado being passed around as San Justo. But now I wish my mind wouldn't pick up on things like this so easily...
 
Messages
48
Reaction score
14
Location
Byron, CA
Not your fault @SpotlightForRareTornadoes, and even TornadoTalk has the video labeled wrong (pinging @WIL9287), but I wish people would stop passing around that footage of a 2009 tornado in Brazil as the Tuba City tornado. There's also a modified photograph of a 2003 Nebraska tornado being passed around as San Justo. But now I wish my mind wouldn't pick up on things like this so easily...
Actually, it's a potato video of it . But still, I think it's crazy to take a photo that that and slap a new name on it. The only thing that makes that possibility false is that if you look closely, you can see the rotation going counterclockwise. Either the person who uploaded the video reversed it or it's anticyclonic. Unfortunately, the mystery is unclear thanks to the crude resolution and frame speed as the video is 13 (or 14) years old. So, if the footage was NOT from Tuba City, then the true location where the tornado was filmed remains a mystery.
 
Last edited:

TH2002

Member
Sustaining Member
Messages
3,188
Reaction score
4,830
Location
California, United States
Special Affiliations
  1. SKYWARN® Volunteer
The most intense damage I could find from the 1980 Kalamazoo tornado

Homes with roof and exterior wall loss:
MBLYG7E3URGNXBP3JSEUJHBIQU.JPG

YQVPGYJVB5DDZBE7JDI32IP23A.JPG

QO4EXJU2EBFURNZGMNIQBZ4I5Y.JPG

MXOTDRT46NEIHMMOSZHMJCC5HM.JPG


St. Augustine Elementary School, which lost several upper floor exterior walls and had its gymnasium collapse:
X2JTULSV75EKVE4KE2GWDAQH7A.JPG

TDPFF2NKKFABDCQXCPNZWGL7PU.JPG


A brick church and business that collapsed:
EFYTZ5GVMJEELC4VDQKIXL5U4E.JPG

2QWBGLDM55CJ7NZYM5PLFPGKBI.JPG


Partially debarked tree:
NRWFJRL7NND7DN7KN5FELRVHVE.JPG


Damage to historic masonry buildings in downtown Kalamazoo:
GIJD3V43T5ANNGTMPYK2N34G7I.JPG

RI5XNC2TWVGDPEN523EWH7CUGE.JPG


While I do think this tornado deserves a low-end F3 rating, I doubt it would be rated EF3 today.
 

TH2002

Member
Sustaining Member
Messages
3,188
Reaction score
4,830
Location
California, United States
Special Affiliations
  1. SKYWARN® Volunteer
Actually, it's a potato video of it . But still, I think it's crazy to take a photo that that and slap a new name on it. The only thing that makes that possibility false is that if you look closely, you can see the rotation going counterclockwise. Either the person who uploaded the video reversed it or it's anticyclonic. Unfortunately, the mystery is unclear thanks to the crude resolution and frame speed as the video is 13 (or 14) years old. So, if the footage was NOT from Tuba City, then the true location where the tornado was filmed remains a mystery.

It isn't.

As for the faux tornado picture from San Justo, Which one are you talking about?
8amh75k1lf141.jpg


It's a photo of the 2003 O'Neill, NE tornado. I couldn't find the exact original, but here is the tornado:
mqdefault.jpg
 
Messages
48
Reaction score
14
Location
Byron, CA
The most intense damage I could find from the 1980 Kalamazoo tornado

Homes with roof and exterior wall loss:
MBLYG7E3URGNXBP3JSEUJHBIQU.JPG

YQVPGYJVB5DDZBE7JDI32IP23A.JPG

QO4EXJU2EBFURNZGMNIQBZ4I5Y.JPG

MXOTDRT46NEIHMMOSZHMJCC5HM.JPG


St. Augustine Elementary School, which lost several upper floor exterior walls and had its gymnasium collapse:
X2JTULSV75EKVE4KE2GWDAQH7A.JPG

TDPFF2NKKFABDCQXCPNZWGL7PU.JPG


A brick church and business that collapsed:
EFYTZ5GVMJEELC4VDQKIXL5U4E.JPG

2QWBGLDM55CJ7NZYM5PLFPGKBI.JPG


Partially debarked tree:
NRWFJRL7NND7DN7KN5FELRVHVE.JPG


Damage to historic masonry buildings in downtown Kalamazoo:
GIJD3V43T5ANNGTMPYK2N34G7I.JPG

RI5XNC2TWVGDPEN523EWH7CUGE.JPG


While I do think this tornado deserves a low-end F3 rating, I doubt it would be rated EF3 today.
The tornado was the first to be caught on amateur video https://www.kpl.gov/video/kalamazoo-mi-tornado-may-13-1980-raw-video/.
 

HAwkmoon

Member
Messages
13
Reaction score
2
Location
Europe
It really is incredible. I can't help wondering just how far a tornado is capable of throwing a vehicle under the right circumstances. I've been able to verify a few that were right around a mile, which is more or less in line with most of the other relatively well-substantiated cases I've seen, so I've always used that as kind of a rough credibility threshold. Who knows, though.

Edit: Also, while I'm on the topic, another thing that blew my mind about the area where that car was. Don't remember if I mentioned it in the article or not, but the ground was scoured so deep in parts of the golf course that it exposed the underground irrigation lines. One of the ball washers was also ripped out with such force that it pulled some of the piping out of the ground.

Edit 2: This area is also directly next to the famous "textbook F5" house that may or may not have actually been swept away by the tornado:

famous-swept-away-but-maybe-not-home.jpg
Are there any other photos of Bridge Creek you have, or sites you can link for? Are there any photos of those exposed irrigation pipes? Thanks
 
Back
Top