Significant Tornado Events

[atrainguy]

Man, New Richmond was so close to the end of the tornado's life, if only it lifted just a mile or two earlier. I seem to recall it being the same thing with Pomeroy 1893. On the ground for dozens of miles, avoiding Storm Lake and some other towns, only to smack into Pomeroy at the last minute.

Question - I've seen people refer to it's destruction and fatalities as Jarrell-like a few times, was this tornado reported as a particularly slow mover? Just wondering if it took its time chewing on the town like Jarrell, and if that contributed to how extreme the effects of it were.

 

[locomusic01]

Man, New Richmond was so close to the end of the tornado's life, if only it lifted just a mile or two earlier. I seem to recall it being the same thing with Pomeroy 1893. On the ground for dozens of miles, avoiding Storm Lake and some other towns, only to smack into Pomeroy at the last minute.

Question - I've seen people refer to it's destruction and fatalities as Jarrell-like a few times, was this tornado reported as a particularly slow mover? Just wondering if it took its time chewing on the town like Jarrell, and if that contributed to how extreme the effects of it were.

You'd think so, but nope. Part of what makes it so impressive is that it was moving between 35 and 45 mph on average. It was also "only" about 600-800 yards wide when it went through New Richmond itself, so any given area was subjected to extreme winds for.. maybe 30 seconds max?

And yeah, Pomeroy was very near the end of its path as well:

 

[atrainguy]

You'd think so, but nope. Part of what makes it so impressive is that it was moving between 35 and 45 mph on average. It was also "only" about 600-800 yards wide when it went through New Richmond itself, so any given area was subjected to extreme winds for.. maybe 30 seconds max?

And yeah, Pomeroy was very near the end of its path as well:

It's amazing (and terrifying) that winds can become that extreme under the right conditions. I wonder what other tornadoes have reached that intensity in more recent times. I suppose Smithville could be another tornado that reached that level? Moving at even higher speeds and basically wiping out the part of town it hit.

 

[locomusic01]

It's amazing (and terrifying) that winds can become that extreme under the right conditions. I wonder what other tornadoes have reached that intensity in more recent times. I suppose Smithville could be another tornado that reached that level? Moving at even higher speeds and basically wiping out the part of town it hit.

Yeah, Smithville is one of maybe half a dozen or so tornadoes you could list in the tier of "most violent ever documented" in almost any order, and the fact that it did what it did while cruising along at such high speeds is wild. Especially considering that its insanely violent core was tiny and probably affected a given area for a few seconds. I'm of the opinion that forward speed/wind duration is usually a bit overrated, but that kind of near-instantaneous destruction is remarkable.

 

[Lake Martin EF4]

Wanna track this down? NWS says it's from Grand Island, but "exact location and time unknown".

EDIT: Given this looks like a real biggun and the Crystal Lake F4 was almost a mile wile, I'd wager this could very well be said F4. But we'd need to identify the location of the photo first.

EDIT 2: Yep after mapping it out we're almost certainly looking at the F4 here. Never thought photos existed of this one.

 

[Western_KS_Wx]

Speaking of some fast-moving violent tornadoes I recently stumbled upon some impressive damage photos from the 2013 Washington Illinois tornado. Videos taken very near or in some cases literally in the tornado all show that the most intense winds lasted at most 10-20 seconds.


Some intense wind rowing clearly evident, extremely rare for November-December tornadoes.


Large multi-story homes were completely swept clean and in some cases entire rows of homes were left as bare foundations. The home at top left in the bottom photo even had its back basement wall collapse outward and sub flooring completely removed.

While officially rated high-end EF4 some of the damage could probably warrant an EF5 rating and I kind of have a hard time believing there wasn’t at least one home that was properly anchored in the dozens that were swept clean. Easily up there with some of the strongest fall/winter time tornadoes on record.

 

[Lake Martin EF4]

some of the damage could probably warrant an EF5 rating

Ahah yes, this was the one that according to @CheeselandSkies was indeed considered for EF5. "Political reasons" ensured an EF4 rating.

 

[Western_KS_Wx]

Ahah yes, this was the one that according to @CheeselandSkies was indeed considered for EF5. "Political reasons" ensured an EF4 rating.

I remember reading about that on an old StormTrack thread as well where there was talk about pulling the trigger on the EF5 rating but dropped it for that same reason, which honestly doesn’t make much sense. There was also an argument that the homes swept clean still had their sub flooring attached and were improperly anchored, which again is a flawed argument as you don’t have to look far to see there were homes that had their subfloors completely removed and appeared well-constructed.

 

[CheeselandSkies]

Ahah yes, this was the one that according to @CheeselandSkies was indeed considered for EF5. "Political reasons" ensured an EF4 rating.

I don't recall saying that about the 2013 Washington tornado. The 2015 Rochelle, IL tornado was pegged right at the top of the EF4 range (200 MPH) but I don't know the exact reason why.

 

[TH2002]

To date I've seen no proof (and very little evidence) that any tornado was lowballed for "political reasons" - at the same time, would I be shocked if that happened? Not at all.

 

[Ivanthetornadoenthusiast]

Another past tornado footage from Saudi Arabia showed quite impressive rotation.

I thought that footage was from Qatar

 

[Western_KS_Wx]

To date I've seen no proof (and very little evidence) that any tornado was lowballed for "political reasons" - at the same time, would I be shocked if that happened? Not at all.

Ended up finding those stormtrack messages, interesting to say the least.

 

[Juliett Bravo Kilo]

Speaking of some fast-moving violent tornadoes I recently stumbled upon some impressive damage photos from the 2013 Washington Illinois tornado. Videos taken very near or in some cases literally in the tornado all show that the most intense winds lasted at most 10-20 seconds.
View attachment 18713
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Some intense wind rowing clearly evident, extremely rare for November-December tornadoes.
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Large multi-story homes were completely swept clean and in some cases entire rows of homes were left as bare foundations. The home at top left in the bottom photo even had its back basement wall collapse outward and sub flooring completely removed.
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While officially rated high-end EF4 some of the damage could probably warrant an EF5 rating and I kind of have a hard time believing there wasn’t at least one home that was properly anchored in the dozens that were swept clean. Easily up there with some of the strongest fall/winter time tornadoes on record.

Sometimes I wonder if the high-end EF4 rating of this tornado led to the EF4 debacle with Vilonia. For a winter tornado this is easily among the most violent ever documented.

 

[Juliett Bravo Kilo]

Yeah, Smithville is one of maybe half a dozen or so tornadoes you could list in the tier of "most violent ever documented" in almost any order, and the fact that it did what it did while cruising along at such high speeds is wild. Especially considering that its insanely violent core was tiny and probably affected a given area for a few seconds. I'm of the opinion that forward speed/wind duration is usually a bit overrated, but that kind of near-instantaneous destruction is remarkable.

I think Smithville is one of the few time wind speeds in excess of 320 mph were right at the Earth's surface. It managed to do Jarrell-type damage while traveling ~70 mph. I wonder what about Smithville's supercell allowed it to spawn such a violent tornado even in comparison to the rest of 4/27/11?
Due to how narrow its core was Smithville strikes me as being a more extreme Niles-Wheatland.

 

[andyhb]

Ended up finding those stormtrack messages, interesting to say the least.
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Hmmm... these things keep getting mentioned by some rather reputable sources.

 

[TH2002]

Ended up finding those stormtrack messages, interesting to say the least.
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Of course...

Adam Lucio is a pretty trustworthy guy in my view, and that comment was made three years after the tornado so I can't say it was emotionally charged or anything. If political reasons are indeed being considered for (and in other words, contaminating) tornado ratings, I have to wonder if it's at all possible for someone to set the record straight, or if it's already too late.

 

[Tomcats Forever!]

Of course...

Adam Lucio is a pretty trustworthy guy in my view, and that comment was made three years after the tornado so I can't say it was emotionally charged or anything. If political reasons are indeed being considered for (and in other words, contaminating) tornado ratings, I have to wonder if it's at all possible for someone to set the record straight, or if it's already too late.

Maybe if you were able to get Tim Marshall really drunk.

 

[Western_KS_Wx]

It also completely takes out the whole scientific point of getting the actual rating right. Anyways, found some more pretty high-end photos from Washington, seems like one of the more underrated EF5 candidates out there.

This photo is pretty ridiculous and you can make out wind-rowing as well. The complete annihilation of whole subdivisions with large well-built homes is very impressive.


These two photos are taken from the same area where some of most violent damage occurred. I’m not sure if the home at bottom right was under construction or what but it appears to be literally wiped out of existence, it’s also visible in the first image as well towards the left. Another house across the street toward the upper half of the second image also had its sub flooring ripped away.

 

[Juliett Bravo Kilo]

It also completely takes out the whole scientific point of getting the actual rating right. Anyways, found some more pretty high-end photos from Washington, seems like one of the more underrated EF5 candidates out there.
View attachment 18749
This photo is pretty ridiculous and you can make out wind-rowing as well. The complete annihilation of whole subdivisions with large well-built homes is very impressive.
View attachment 18750
View attachment 18751
These two photos are taken from the same area where some of most violent damage occurred. I’m not sure if the home at bottom right was under construction or what but it appears to be literally wiped out of existence, it’s also visible in the first image as well towards the left. Another house across the street toward the upper half of the second image also had its sub flooring ripped away.
View attachment 18752
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Yeah, those aerials remind me of Moore 2013.

 

[MNTornadoGuy]

Has anyone actually seen a close-up of the foundations from the Washington 2013 tornado?