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Marshal79344

Member
Messages
234
Location
Chicago, IL
I wouldn't doubt that the Louisville Tornado also reached EF5 intensity along its path. This tornado was produced by a completely discrete supercell without any interference from convection around it, unlike all the other major tornadoes on that day. I have a feeling that the discrete aspect of the parent supercell contributed somewhat to its violent intensity. There were several obvious violent tornado damage indicators all along the path, unlike any other tornado that day.

The Louisville Tornado as filmed from a home video when it was at its peak intensity southeast of the town.

20140428LOUISVILLEFUNNEL2.jpg

The Louisville Tornado as it was striking the suburbs. Note how it's shrouded in debris.

20140428LOUISVILLETORNADO.jpg

Some of the instances of debarking that the Louisville Tornado produced were absolutely extraordinary

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Damage Photos I have in my archives

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Nightking2021

Member
Messages
53
Location
Wichita, Kansas
I wouldn't doubt that the Louisville Tornado also reached EF5 intensity along its path. This tornado was produced by a completely discrete supercell without any interference from convection around it, unlike all the other major tornadoes on that day. I have a feeling that the discrete aspect of the parent supercell contributed somewhat to its violent intensity. There were several obvious violent tornado damage indicators all along the path, unlike any other tornado that day.

The Louisville Tornado as filmed from a home video when it was at its peak intensity southeast of the town.

View attachment 8417

The Louisville Tornado as it was striking the suburbs. Note how it's shrouded in debris.

View attachment 8416

Some of the instances of debarking that the Louisville Tornado produced were absolutely extraordinary

View attachment 8418
View attachment 8419
View attachment 8420

Damage Photos I have in my archives

View attachment 8422

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The damage looks on par with Bassfield. It is almost certain that it reached EF5 intensity along its path. I would have rated the Louisville, MS tornado at least a high-end EF4.
 

buckeye05

Member
Messages
923
Location
Riverside, Ohio
Here is another tornado in Louisville, MS that happened the day after Vilonia and is often overlooked. https://www.weather.gov/jan/2014_04_27_28_29_winston_tor
It got overshadowed due to all the (justified) bickering over the Vilonia rating, but yes, Louisville was definitely a high-end event. One specific thing that really, really interests me is what happened at the Eiland Plaza Apartments in town. Multiple large, two-story, well built and brick construction apartment buildings were absolutely flattened in that complex, and judging by some photos and aerial videos I have seen, at least one was reduced to a bare slab. If there wasn't some kind of glaring structural flaw, that would make it by far, the most intense damage ever done to an apartment building that I know of. Tuscaloosa/Birmingham and Joplin 2011 completely destroyed many apartment buildings, but even those two monster tornadoes didn't manage to sweep any of them away.
 
Messages
761
Location
Madison, WI
5/24/11 was an interesting day. Relatively few tornadoes, but a large proportion of them were extraordinarily violent (as or more so than any 27 days earlier). It was also odd in that there seemed to be a relatively narrow east-west area of favorable parameters (although the high risk area was much wider). Other than Lookeba followed by El Reno, the main supercells seemed to be one-and-done when it came to significant tornado production. This proved very fortunate for the OKC metro, as the Chickasha tornado was paralleling the path of the 5/3/99 one and dissipated just as it was on the verge of creating another major disaster in Moore/Norman/Newcastle two years ahead of when it ended up happening.
 

buckeye05

Member
Messages
923
Location
Riverside, Ohio
Right there in that photo you posted, I circled the area of interest. That's Eiland Plaza, and that to me looks like a completely slabbed brick apartment building.
mz2YLmx.png


A fact check using the DAT confirms my suspicions. This thing slabbed an entire two story apartment building. Geez.
268003
 

pohnpei

Member
Messages
387
Location
shanghai
I wouldn't doubt that the Louisville Tornado also reached EF5 intensity along its path. This tornado was produced by a completely discrete supercell without any interference from convection around it, unlike all the other major tornadoes on that day. I have a feeling that the discrete aspect of the parent supercell contributed somewhat to its violent intensity. There were several obvious violent tornado damage indicators all along the path, unlike any other tornado that day.

The Louisville Tornado as filmed from a home video when it was at its peak intensity southeast of the town.

View attachment 8417

The Louisville Tornado as it was striking the suburbs. Note how it's shrouded in debris.

View attachment 8416

Some of the instances of debarking that the Louisville Tornado produced were absolutely extraordinary

View attachment 8418
View attachment 8419
View attachment 8420

Damage Photos I have in my archives

View attachment 8422

View attachment 8423
View attachment 8425
Do you have the link of the home video of the first pic you posted?
Several other pics to add
some ground scouring maybe?
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ground view of the apartment area
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softwood damage in the town
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EF4 tree damage from another view
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damage in rural area
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engine from vehicle
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scar of the tornado left
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There was little damage photo can be found area of that 185mph rating house with incredible softwood debarking nearby except for two photos on damage viewer. That house seems very newly built but lack of additional construction details that I can find. Hope to find more.
 
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pohnpei

Member
Messages
387
Location
shanghai
It got overshadowed due to all the (justified) bickering over the Vilonia rating, but yes, Louisville was definitely a high-end event. One specific thing that really, really interests me is what happened at the Eiland Plaza Apartments in town. Multiple large, two-story, well built and brick construction apartment buildings were absolutely flattened in that complex, and judging by some photos and aerial videos I have seen, at least one was reduced to a bare slab. If there wasn't some kind of glaring structural flaw, that would make it by far, the most intense damage ever done to an apartment building that I know of. Tuscaloosa/Birmingham and Joplin 2011 completely destroyed many apartment buildings, but even those two monster tornadoes didn't manage to sweep any of them away.
It seems that there was even no corresponding wind can be given to total destruction of the entire apartment building(even not swept away) in EF scale. Maybe it was considered impossible for tornados to do that damage? The total destruction of top two floors of very well built apartment building was already EF5 level. The Louisville's apartment building damage was rated 175mph. Some other cases like Washington IL's apartment building was rated 180mph, Tuscaloosa's apartment building was rated 190mph, Cookeville's apartment building was rated 170mph.(swept away?) There was several apartment building hit by Joplin but it seems like none of them was given EF4 rating in Tim Marshall's article.
277b708ec549387f.jpg
 

pohnpei

Member
Messages
387
Location
shanghai
Right there in that photo you posted, I circled the area of interest. That's Eiland Plaza, and that to me looks like a completely slabbed brick apartment building.
mz2YLmx.png


A fact check using the DAT confirms my suspicions. This thing slabbed an entire two story apartment building. Geez.
268003
Do you happen to know what's the big slab right side of the first pic used to be? I checked on damage viewer and it appears to me that the whole area had been given a general rating, not for each specific house, which is quite confusing.
 

buckeye05

Member
Messages
923
Location
Riverside, Ohio
It seems that there was even no corresponding wind can be given to total destruction of the entire apartment building(even not swept away) in EF scale. Maybe it was considered impossible for tornados to do that damage? The total destruction of top two floors of very well built apartment building was already EF5 level. The Louisville's apartment building damage was rated 175mph. Some other cases like Washington IL's apartment building was rated 180mph, Tuscaloosa's apartment building was rated 190mph, Cookeville's apartment building was rated 170mph.(swept away?) There was several apartment building hit by Joplin but it seems like none of them was been given EF4 rating in Tim Marshall's article.
View attachment 8434
I forgot about Cookeville. That one kinda swept away an apartment building too, but just sort of threw the debris into a heap, and the lower story which was built into a hillside stayed intact, with vehicles in the parking lot pushed together, but not thrown. They rated it 170 MPH. IDK exactly what to make of it.
1277626

1277652
 

buckeye05

Member
Messages
923
Location
Riverside, Ohio
Yeah I don't like to think about the idea of two EF4s that should have been rated EF5 from the outbreak, but sometimes it does cross my mind. Also, am I just seeing things, or are there large anchor bolts visible along the perimeter of the slabbed house in the background of the interview at 1:04?
 

WhirlingWx

Member
Messages
133
Location
Northern DFW Metroplex
I think the big takeaway is that people should stop looking too hard into the "EF5 drought," because just because no tornado has been rated EF5 since 2013, doesn't mean that we haven't had a single tornado actually attain EF5 winds in that timeframe since then. Several potential/likely candidates for EF5 intensity post-2013 that have been recently mentioned in this thread include Chapman, Rochelle, Bassfield, and even Louisville. I think a lot of us do agree that Vilonia actually caused EF5 damage, and just wasn't rated as such because of the massive oversight by LZK's lead surveyor for the event. All of this is while also excluding any of the EF4 tornadoes from the Pilger supercell (of which one or more could have attained EF5 strength), and I'm probably missing some other examples as well.
 

Nightking2021

Member
Messages
53
Location
Wichita, Kansas
I remember some years ago talking with a guy from NWS in Jackson named Alan Gerard. I know that they tend to do really well with rating tornadoes properly but Alan Gerard told he is really conservative with giving out an EF5 rating. I know the Philadelphia, MS tornado was originally rated an EF4 with winds around 180 mph. However, since over two feet of topsoil was removed from an area prompted to upgrade to an EF5 with winds of 205 mph. If that had not been discovered it would have remained an EF4 with 180 mph winds. In fact Louisville was assigned a winds speed of 185 mph, Bassfield was assigned a wind of 190 mph, and Philadelphia a wind of 205 mph. Those are the three highest wind speeds I have known that office to assign to a tornado ever since the EF-scale was implemented. So it may be possible the Louisville, MS tornado was conservatively rated an EF4. However, I am not 100% sure of that either.
 

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