• Welcome to TalkWeather!
    We see you lurking around TalkWeather! Take the extra step and join us today to view attachments, see less ads and maybe even join the discussion.
    CLICK TO JOIN TALKWEATHER

Severe WX December 10 & 11, 2021 Severe Threat

CheeselandSkies said:
I'm sure it was outside the core, otherwise that guy wouldn't be alive.

I remember from the live coverage of 4/27, James Spann mentioning that some tugboat operators on the Tombigbee River were nearly hit by tornadoes during the prior 4/15 outbreak. "Talk about being in a bad spot, there's not much they can do!"
Click to expand...

I don’t know, this got me looking at tugboat specs and those things are massive. I don’t know if even hit with the EF5 core if the wind could get underneath it to move it.

I wouldn’t want to be on it, but it may be one of the safer places to be.
 
ARCC said:
I don’t know, this got me looking at tugboat specs and those things are massive. I don’t know if even hit with the EF5 core if the wind could get underneath it to move it.

I wouldn’t want to be on it, but it may be one of the safer places to be.
Click to expand...

I'd be most concerned about debris impacts. To shelter from debris penetrating the superstructure, you'd want to go below into the hull (the boat's equivalent of a "basement"), but then if debris penetrates the hull, you may be trapped if/when it floods/sinks.
 
CheeselandSkies said:
I'd be most concerned about debris impacts. To shelter from debris penetrating the superstructure, you'd want to go below into the hull (the boat's equivalent of a "basement"), but then if debris penetrates the hull, you may be trapped if/when it floods/sinks.
Click to expand...
That would be a little concerning, but I’d feel pretty good being behind the 3/8” to 1/2” steel plate of the hull.
 
Utter devastation in Mayfield. The tornado here was probably not as intense as in Bremen but it was still extremely violent. I'll post more photos I found later.





270087007_1891458854363477_2681415671812301201_n.jpg

267317197_3170319146557212_4534647865247938827_n.jpg

266092292_4844163905635125_5149647908392989503_n.jpg

unknown.png
 
MNTornadoGuy said:
View attachment 11457
Click to expand...

A lot of times eom
Sawmaster said:
The bottom pic shows both end-nailed studs and the anchor-bolting retrofitted with expanding bolts; not poured-in-place standard anchor bolts. Given these the max rating available would be EF-4.

But what really sucks is that even though these anchor bolts held, if the rest of the structure was up to EF-5 DI's they would almost certainly still rate EF-4 because of the type of anchor bolt used not being "correct" even though these clearly held and did the job adequately. Therein lies the problems of using engineers for damage surveys. I don't know how many of you have had to deal with these people directly but in my 45 years of construction work I've crossed paths with them too many times. And while I don't like to categorize people as there's always exceptions, I have never met an engineer who didn't have a hugely-inflated ego with a side-order of "God complex" thrown in. More than a few times I've shown them obvious errors in their designs and ways to easily do things better but they won't accept it. Yes we do need engineers involved with damage surveys; just not in the capacity and with the authority of how they're being used now. Because of this we're getting incorrect answers to our questions and until we change the approach that will continue.

Phil
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, that's an all too common theme of what it's like when dealing with certain engineers. Usually it's because they lack experience working on active job sites and major construction projects. That lack of real world experience is a major issue especially on the design side. Theoreticals get smashed to pieces awfully quick in the real world.

Whenever a guy tells you his boots have lasted for over 20 years it's probably a sign. However, there is a significant difference between Engineers who are in the office virtually every day year round and those who spend a significant amount of time out in the field working on active projects.

That said, there's also some Engineers who have the real world experience yet can't get out of the way of their ego. Engineer stereotypes exist for a reason.

It's s tough for me to argue the experience you've had because it's an all too common occurrence.

That said, I've been incredibly fortunate at my current employer to work alongside some truly brilliant Engineers who possess just the right mix of experience, education, and personality. We have a very strong focus on culture, mentorship, and serving our clients. No sacred cows allowed.

There's a lot of gifted and humble Engineers out there too. I hope you start running across more of them than you have in your previous experiences.
 
So far I have been unable to find the light poles that were supposedly ripped out of the ground. Though I have found light-poles that were sheared off at ground level. Debris impacts from the university probably played a major role in this damage.
8BD7E99D-569B-40FE-9860-FEFF4DBCB436.jpeg
B3A20933-788A-45EA-B09D-B5BDA643C1B6.jpeg
B804F687-6A09-41DE-8CE4-8A9D177A1111.jpeg
0ECA8CD2-1FCC-4509-A573-06C8C48948AA.jpeg
 
Last edited:
MNTornadoGuy said:
Utter devastation in Mayfield. The tornado here was probably not as intense as in Bremen but it was still extremely violent. I'll post more photos I found later.





270087007_1891458854363477_2681415671812301201_n.jpg

267317197_3170319146557212_4534647865247938827_n.jpg

266092292_4844163905635125_5149647908392989503_n.jpg

unknown.png
Click to expand...

I'm just a layman and I am sorry but there is no way that is from anything less than F5 pictures I have seen before. The cars, trees, houses, and trenches all point to more than F4. Don't tell me it's raining while you are p***ing on my head.
 
Austin Dawg said:
I'm just a layman and I am sorry but there is no way that is from anything less than F5 pictures I have seen before. The cars, trees, houses, and trenches all point to more than F4. Don't tell me it's raining while you are p***ing on my head.
Click to expand...
That chemical tank truck completely mangled beyond recognition reminds me of vehicle damage from the Andover tornado and some other tornadoes as well. Calling this tornado only a high-end EF4 is just stretching the bounds way too much.
 
MNTornadoGuy said:
View of one of the homes that was destroyed in Cambridge Shores. It was bolted to its foundation however it appears the concrete basement walls are only continuous on one side and one of the bolts appears to be missing washers.
Click to expand...
I'd still like someone to explain how this is EF3 damage...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top