Significant Tornado Events

[tornado examiner]

is the browning of the ground here actually from scouring? cause if it is it only reenforces my opinion that the tornado was of EF5 intensity here. cause this tornado was moving quite fast through here. likely around 55 to 65 mph.

 

[SouthFLwx]

is the browning of the ground here actually from scouring? cause if it is it only reenforces my opinion that the tornado was of EF5 intensity here. cause this tornado was moving quite fast through here. likely around 55 to 65 mph.

Looks like it might be a combo of some ground scouring + clean up.

 

[tornado examiner]

Looks like it might be a combo of some ground scouring + clean up.

even still that seriously twisted and nearly completely debarked tree next to that upside-down truck shows how violent it was through there. not to mention the debris granulation and windrowing.

 

[Sawmaster]

I can see what you're speaking of. If this exact location is known and was surveyed there might be an answer there. If there was sparse-to-no ground-cover vegetation beforehand this could be loose dirt blown in a pattern drying unevenly, but could equally be mild scouring.

Some good close-up pics of the site and surrounding areas would help if they exist. And they should, however...........

Phil

 

[tornado examiner]

I can see what you're speaking of. If this exact location is known and was surveyed there might be an answer there. If there was sparse-to-no ground-cover vegetation beforehand this could be loose dirt blown in a pattern drying unevenly, but could equally be mild scouring.

Some good close-up pics of the site and surrounding areas would help if they exist. And they should, however...........

Phil

this is that row of houses near that one cmu house that was blasted away with Smithville like violence. the one we've all seen cause its probably the structure that got hit the hardest in bremen despite its cmu construction.

 

[tornado examiner]

its shown in this video actually

 

[pohnpei]

I can see what you're speaking of. If this exact location is known and was surveyed there might be an answer there. If there was sparse-to-no ground-cover vegetation beforehand this could be loose dirt blown in a pattern drying unevenly, but could equally be mild scouring.

Some good close-up pics of the site and surrounding areas would help if they exist. And they should, however...........

Phil

Photos of this place

 

[tornado examiner]

yeah...every time i look at this area i become more and more certain the tornado was producing at least 200MPH winds in this area.

 

[Sawmaster]

Thanks for the pics, but I'm still not sure if it's scouring though strong wind violence is very clearly evident. Maybe marginal scouring in spots. Here again the systemic problems emerge where scouring shouldn't be needed to make the call one way or another and I'm inclined to think this EF-5 level damage too.

Phil

 

[tornado examiner]

probably little top soil removed but definitely alot of grass torn out and plastered all over everything. i've never seen grass plastering that extensive.

 

[Sawmaster]

probably little top soil removed but definitely alot of grass torn out and plastered all over everything. i've never seen grass plastering that extensive.

Many example of that but I've only seen it in the strongest tornadoes, which sort of makes the point here. I really just wish we didn't need to be discussing this for the reason we are; there would be more and better for everyone had they rated Bremem correctly instead of that dividing and distracting us.

Phil

 

[tornado examiner]

Many example of that but I've only seen it in the strongest tornadoes, which sort of makes the point here. I really just wish we didn't need to be discussing this for the reason we are; there would be more and better for everyone had they rated Bremem correctly instead of that dividing and distracting us.

Phil

indeed.

 

[tornado examiner]

near the beginning of the Mayfield tornado the small intense vortex wobbled side to side very very noticeably.

 

[tornado examiner]

bremen will go down as one of the best examples of extreme EF5 contextual damage under-rated because of construction quality....well...apart from that one home rated 190 that should have been a clear EF5 point. under-rated because trees next to the home weren't quote "gone" cause apparently tree's need to be straight up gone in order too get an EF5 rating.

 

[xJownage]

Couple things to note.

1. A single EF-5 DI doesn't necessarily indicate that the tornado should be rated EF-5.
2. Tornado ratings now are supposed to be minimum-bound. That means that a tornado rated EF-4 190mph can be confirmed, based on damage, to have at least 190 mph winds. That rating means they can verify that there were, with almost 100% certainty, winds of that strength. It doesn't discount that wind speed could've been higher, and doesn't say that they don't think the wind speed was higher, but that they can verify the wind speed of the rating happened.

I think #2 is what a lot of people miss. It's a minimum bound, guaranteed wind speed. Not how strong we think the tornado was.

 

[CalebRoutt]

Bremen isn’t the only area of **Possible** EF5 damage. For example there’s an area just SW of Mayfield where homes were swept clean. 1 of which was well built with all anchor bolts bent some ripped out. Every tree was sheared to near or at ground level, and several vehicles including a pickup truck was thrown ~300 yards. This home was likely just as well built as the Bremen home, however poor roof connections prevented this from getting rated EF5.

Photo Creds: NWS Paducah and DFW Storm Chasers

 

[SouthFLwx]

Bremen isn’t the only area of **Possible** EF5 damage. For example there’s an area just SW of Mayfield where homes were swept clean. 1 of which was well built with all anchor bolts bent some ripped out. Every tree was sheared to near or at ground level, and several vehicles including a pickup truck was thrown ~300 yards. This home was likely just as well built as the Bremen home, however poor roof connections prevented this from getting rated EF5.

Photo Creds: NWS Paducah and DFW Storm Chasers

Maybe even some ground scouring here too?

 

[CalebRoutt]

Maybe even some ground scouring here too?

Its possible

 

[tornado examiner]

Couple things to note.

1. A single EF-5 DI doesn't necessarily indicate that the tornado should be rated EF-5.
2. Tornado ratings now are supposed to be minimum-bound. That means that a tornado rated EF-4 190mph can be confirmed, based on damage, to have at least 190 mph winds. That rating means they can verify that there were, with almost 100% certainty, winds of that strength. It doesn't discount that wind speed could've been higher, and doesn't say that they don't think the wind speed was higher, but that they can verify the wind speed of the rating happened.

I think #2 is what a lot of people miss. It's a minimum bound, guaranteed wind speed. Not how strong we think the tornado was.

thats not what the scale says dude.

 

[xJownage]

thats not what the scale says dude.

You should read the scale and the interpretation. Wind speed ratings are solely what engineers can prove happened with 100% certainty. No more. If 190 mph winds CAN explain the damage observed, it cannot be rated higher.