Significant Tornado Events

[Juliett Bravo Kilo]

Damage in the cherokee valley definitely meets the EF5 range.Numerous huge FR12 get completely demolished, the debris pattern also quite fits what an EF5 did to houses
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But some questions still kept nagging me, borderline EF5 like Tuscaloosa and Ringgold have limit car damage.In extreme case, you can find cars being intact near clean slabs and completely debarked trees.I know car damage is defect to most Dixie violent but the great incongruity in tors with such strength still looks unexplainable

Tuscaloosa's EF4 rating is appropriate; it didn't do any massive ground scouring, completely strip low-lying vegetation, throw automobiles hundreds of yards and mangle them beyond recognition and the type of stuff you'd expect with an EF5. As for the apartments that were a source of contention, they weren't all that well-constructed or well-anchored. Yes, it threw some heavy objects, but that by itself isn't enough to qualify for an EF5 rating. I really don't see why there's any controversy over Tuscaloosa still.

 

[eric11]

EF4 is fine since no homes were well built there, though 175 seems far too low. Hard to find a properly bolted house in many rural areas. I'd say a majority of the country doesn't have anything to hit that would register a true EF5 rating barring incredible feats a la Philadelphia, MS.

Ringgold would have likely been ranked F5 on the old scale before the La Plata debacle and subsequent close evaluation of construction quality; it would be nice to be able to objectively look at pre-2000 F4-5 ratings and see which ones would actually stand now that we're paying better attention to construction quality.

have no idea about F4 cuz there're too many and many of them lack information even detailed word description.For F5s between 1980-2000, maybe only 3, Andover,Jarrell,Bridge Creek will be rated EF5 under the current rating system.

 

[pohnpei]

Tuscaloosa's EF4 rating is appropriate; it didn't do any massive ground scouring, completely strip low-lying vegetation, throw automobiles hundreds of yards and mangle them beyond recognition and the type of stuff you'd expect with an EF5. As for the apartments that were a source of contention, they weren't all that well-constructed or well-anchored. Yes, it threw some heavy objects, but that by itself isn't enough to qualify for an EF5 rating. I really don't see why there's any controversy over Tuscaloosa still.

I think people would be more shocked if they see Tuscaloosa's apartment damage 60 or 70 years ago. I haven't seen any other tornado can swept a large section of apartment clean of the foundation(actually subfloor foundation) Now we know the foundation of this apartment was mixed with anchor bolts and cut nails, not very well built. Contextual damage around the apartmet was not EF5 level but wind rowing and debris granulation were evident behind the apartment.

There were some low level shurb debarking in Brimingham area but yes, most cars along the tornado's path didn't move. Brimingham NWS only mentioned some cars in Pleasant Grove were moved 15-20 yards.
Tornados in rural areas which can still manage High End EF4 rating with stronger contextual damage like Bassfield or Ringgold would have a higher chance to manage EF5 intensity if there was a well built town, especially Bassfield.

 

[Juliett Bravo Kilo]

I think people would be more shocked if they see Tuscaloosa's apartment damage 60 or 70 years ago. I haven't seen any other tornado can swept a large section of apartment clean of the foundation(actually subfloor foundation) Now we know the foundation of this apartment was mixed with anchor bolts and cut nails, not very well built. Contextual damage around the apartmet was not EF5 level but wind rowing and debris granulation were evident behind the apartment.
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There were some low level shurb debarking in Brimingham area but yes, most cars along the tornado's path didn't move. Brimingham NWS only mentioned some cars in Pleasant Grove were moved 15-20 yards.

Nice picture, the more I think about it the damage to the apartments could be considered borderline-EF5. I think Tuscaloosa achieved EF5 intensity right around this point but it exited Tuscaloosa (and thus lost any chance of encountering EF5 DIs) and plowed through 35 miles of unpopulated forest. Based on radar measurements Tuscaloosa likely was well into the EF5 category between the two cities, but weakened back to EF4 by the time it hit Birmingham.

 

[speedbump305]

i have a feeling if Tuscaloosa touched

Nice picture, the more I think about it the damage to the apartments could be considered borderline-EF5. I think Tuscaloosa achieved EF5 intensity right around this point but it exited Tuscaloosa (and thus lost any chance of encountering EF5 DIs) and plowed through 35 miles of unpopulated forest. Based on radar measurements Tuscaloosa likely was well into the EF5 category between the two cities, but weakened back to EF4 by the time it hit Birmingham.

Yes. That’s when it appeared most intense. I’d honestly love to see the Velocities from all the Tornadoes that day. It would be so cool if anyone has images of those

 

[eric11]

Tuscaloosa's EF4 rating is appropriate; it didn't do any massive ground scouring, completely strip low-lying vegetation, throw automobiles hundreds of yards and mangle them beyond recognition and the type of stuff you'd expect with an EF5. As for the apartments that were a source of contention, they weren't all that well-constructed or well-anchored. Yes, it threw some heavy objects, but that by itself isn't enough to qualify for an EF5 rating. I really don't see why there's any controversy over Tuscaloosa still.

Massive ground scouring for dixie seems a little bit fastidious considering the tor's moving speed and the rough extent of the underlying surface so I don't regard it as a key indicator to evaluating its rating, the same reason for low-lying vegatation.I've seen some engineering papers clamined winds had access to over 200mph around the apartment so I'll keep my opinion whether the damage right here meet the EF5 range.(If you compare the apartment damage to other EF/F5's apartment damage like Joplin and Plainfield, I'd say Tuscaloosa stands out).Car damage however is a crucial indicator when considering one tor is an EF5 or not in my view.For cases like some damage indicator being in the EF5 range(tree damage, maybe the apartment damage, and heavy object travelling long distance),while others not(car damage, ground scouring and low-lying vegatation like you said),I may call it a borderline EF5 but still an official EF4 rating is the most appropriate rating.We may have different opinions on what a "borderline EF5"should be like but we've reached the same idea Tuscaloosa wasn't an EF5 using the current official standard anyway

 

[buckeye05]

Here's a very underrated tornado imo that doesn't get talked about often. The Columbia, MS EF3 of 12-23-2014 leveled multiple brick homes in the town. At least one of them (first one) was well anchored to its foundation with closely-spaced bolts, and was even partially swept clean. This damage was rated 165 MPH EF3. At that stage, why not just go with EF4? They would have been well within their rights to do so.

 

[pohnpei]

Nice picture, the more I think about it the damage to the apartments could be considered borderline-EF5. I think Tuscaloosa achieved EF5 intensity right around this point but it exited Tuscaloosa (and thus lost any chance of encountering EF5 DIs) and plowed through 35 miles of unpopulated forest. Based on radar measurements Tuscaloosa likely was well into the EF5 category between the two cities, but weakened back to EF4 by the time it hit Birmingham.

It is reasonable to suggest this but the radar based EF5 speculating was more uncertain. The reason why Tuscaloosa's couplet was stronger than Smithville/Hackleburg was that the core of the tornado was bigger, making it easier for radar to scan in a quite long distance. But Tuscaloosa's radar was indeed one of the most impressive in the history anyway.

 

[speedbump305]

It is reasonable to suggest this but the radar based EF5 speculating was more uncertain. The reason why Tuscaloosa's couplet was stronger than Smithville/Hackleburg was that the core of the tornado was bigger, making it easier for radar to scan in a quite long distance. But Tuscaloosa's radar was indeed one of the most impressive in the history

I’ve still yet to see a more impressive Hook echo, Debris ball, supercell structure, and radar couplet than tuscaloosa. The radar image of Tuscaloosa was literally the most impressive i’ve ever seen

 

[pohnpei]

I’ve still yet to see a more impressive Hook echo, Debris ball, supercell structure, and radar couplet than tuscaloosa. The radar image of Tuscaloosa was literally the most impressive i’ve ever seen

The maintain of this hook was just as impressive as the peak couplet it showed. I think the peak couplet of Tuscaloosa was around metal railroad trestle damage area. But still have no idea what kinds of wind it needs to do this damage.

 

[speedbump305]

The maintain of this hook was just as impressive as the peak couplet it showed. I think the peak couplet of Tuscaloosa was around metal railroad trestle damage area. But still have no idea what kinds of wind it needs to do this damage.

Definitely. It managed to keep that Hook for a super long time. If i had to guess, i think winds must be well above 210 mph to destroy a trestle. I’d say it takes a lot a force to do that as well

 

[buckeye05]

Kinda late to the party as I know this topic was discussed a while back, but here are some more recent significant Pacific Northwest region tornadoes.

Aumsville, Oregon EF2 of December 14, 2010:

Manzanita, Oregon EF2 of October 14, 2016:

Port Orchard, Washington EF2 of December 18, 2018

 

[ARCC]

Here's a few interesting instances of damage.

This door was carried by an EF4 tornado from Louisville, MS to the MSU campus, a distance of at least 30 miles:

This was a water pump that was actually lifted out of a well by the first 1974 Tanner tornado:

That isn’t a water pump. Maybe a type of expansion tank that was in a well house.

 

[buckeye05]

That isn’t a water pump.

Yes it is. It was lifted out of well. I had one that looked like this for a koi pond. It was smaller and had a tube coming out of the top, but the "legs" could be attached to the side of the pond wall.

Maybe it's not a "pump" but it was some device used for circulating water, so idk what else to call it. It was called a "water pump" verbatim in the old newspaper clipping where I found it.

 

[ARCC]

Yes it is. It was lifted out of well. I had one that looked like this for a koi pond. It was smaller and had a tube coming out of the top, but the "legs" could be attached to the side of the pond wall.

Maybe it's not a "pump" but it was some device used for circulating water, so idk what else to call it.

Yeah it’s absolutely not a submersible well pump as they look like this.

https://www.waterpumpsdirect.com/products-image/600/RL12G07-3W2V_7578_600.jpg

It could be part of a well assembly such as an expansion tank that the pump is piped into. But it also be part of a air tank at a shop. The legs on the side for attaching to the floor are a dead giveaway it doesn’t go in the well shaft.

Edit: The “super water pump” probably means a “jet well Pump”. That would make sense as it’s a all on the surface in the well house.

 

[buckeye05]

Yeah it’s absolutely not a submersible well pump as they look like this.

https://www.waterpumpsdirect.com/products-image/600/RL12G07-3W2V_7578_600.jpg

It could be part of a well assembly such as an expansion tank that the pump is piped into. But it also be part of a air tank at a shop. The legs on the side for attaching to the floor are a dead giveaway it doesn’t go in the well shaft.

Edit: The “super water pump” probably means a “jet well Pump”. That would make sense as it’s a all on the surface in the well house.

Ohhh ok gotcha. The article I clipped the photo from mentioned it as a "pump" being pulled out of well. I guess the photographer/journalist misidentified what happened here. So this is something that was never in the ground in any way?

 

[ARCC]

Ohhh ok gotcha. The article I clipped the photo from mentioned it as a "pump" being pulled out of well. I guess the photographer/journalist misidentified what happened here. So this is something that was never in the ground in any way?

That part, no. It could have attached to a submersible pump though.

That said, I’m actually wondering if a submersible pump could be pulled out of a well. If the top part of the assembly was cast or galvanized iron, it probably could be if it stayed intact with the tank. That pex pipe running down to the pump is tough and could be pulled out a like a noodle. I don’t know how impressive it would be tornado strength wise, but it certainly would be newspaper worthy.

 

[WIL9287]

Honestly Bassfield unlike ringgold, was JUST PURELY IGNORED AND UNDERRATED. Literally Bassfield swept away a well built cabin with the plumbing torn out the foundation and anchors apparently being bent. By the way i saw this from the damage aerial from Live Storms Media. Bassfield produced Genuine EF5 damage to a home and wasn’t rated EF5 based on tree damage not being severe and ground not scorched enough. it’s just so freaking ridiculous

With all due respect, Bassfield is not ignored or underrated. It is quite possibly the most talked about tornado of 2020, and certainly of the Easter outbreak, which produced several other notable tornadoes. The surveyors actually talked the original builder and there were several flaws with the structure. High-end EF4 is the right call. Here’s a video about the QRT response to Bassfield and Ashby.

 

[pohnpei]

'

With all due respect, Bassfield is not ignored or underrated. It is quite possibly the most talked about tornado of 2020, and certainly of the Easter outbreak, which produced several other notable tornadoes. The surveyors actually talked the original builder and there were several flaws with the structure. High-end EF4 is the right call. Here’s a video about the QRT response to Bassfield and Ashby.

It seems the video can't be played?

 

[pohnpei]

With all due respect, Bassfield is not ignored or underrated. It is quite possibly the most talked about tornado of 2020, and certainly of the Easter outbreak, which produced several other notable tornadoes. The surveyors actually talked the original builder and there were several flaws with the structure. High-end EF4 is the right call. Here’s a video about the QRT response to Bassfield and Ashby.

In terms of Bassfield, the high end rating of that cabin was quite reasonable due to the reason such as the anchor spacing being a little too big around the corner of the house. But reason like vehicle impact, was a little bit contradictory to me. We know when vehicle nearby house wasn't moved then it can be a reason why this house didn't rated EF4 or 5. But when the vehicle was tossed, it was just impossible to rule out the possibility that it had an impact on house damage, especially when the vehicle was tossed in very high speed. It was easy to understand beacuse no one can really figure out what actually happened to a certain damage. It can always be an potential vehicle impact to a house. So there was a contradiction exist to me.
The discussion about Bassfield was for sute widespread at that time and I think many people assume that it reached EF5 intensity some point of lifes. I think they were right. The DIs was so little along its path when at the peak intensity yet the damage it did to these limited DIs was truely remarkable. The true intensity of this tornado can still be underestimated even through the widespread discussion.