Oh duh, I knew there was some I had to be missing. That's a more adequate list.
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Ozonelayer
Member
It's alright. This year has been hard to keep track of!
I feel like Selmer was probably a violent tornado that exclusively impacted homes and buildings that lacked solid foundations and anchoring. Gary hit a slider house, but I’ve been forced to adjust my stance on that one a bit given photos I recently saw showing impressive vehicle lofting/mangling.
But the other two simply should officially be rated EF4, no question about it. The fact that they weren’t is ridiculous.
N0mz
Member
If they want to reexamine some past tornadoes I think my first choices (that were likely just botched surveys) would be New Wren, Vilonia, Chickasha and Goldsby. Some absolute slam dunk EF5 damage there. In light of the reemergence of unconventional DIs, a couple of odd tornado feats that could take a second look: Greenfield windmills (I doubt this one), Rolling Fork water tower, Chapman train. There are a couple I'm not sure on, and not sure they have some weird DI, but Birmingham, Rochelle, Bassfield, and Mayfield probably all deserve another look.
Ozonelayer
Member
Yeah, Bakersfield and Lake City are quite obviously EF-4 structurally and contextually. Even more so now that Vehicle damage/Object lofting has been now used as an EF-5 damage indicator. Gary could be upgraded but that one's more iffy. Your stance on Selmer is respectable too.
Other than those, the higher end tornadoes have been generally more well rated this year. Marion could be a little lower and Tylertown could be a bit higher though, just my opinion.
Ozonelayer
Member
I don't know if they'll upgrade the older ones. But they can for sure take another look at the more recent ones.
I firmly believe based off of this, Mayfield and Rolling Fork should be re-rated EF-5. Matador could be upgraded to EF-4, Greenfield from last year could possibly be upgraded too. If they do re-rate the older ones then the ones you mentioned would be rated EF-5 without a doubt.
N0mz
Member
It's probably also much easier to find the evidence on the water tower and the windmill since they're likely standardized and there's pretty clear documentation of what happened to them. Reexamining a home from 4+ years ago that was probably rebuilt or completely scrapped since then is likely pretty hard.
If you didn’t catch Tim Marshall’s interview on Fox Weather, he stated we are still a “couple of years” away from the EF scale update being released. I think they have been “updating” the scale longer than it took them to compile the original enhanced scale release.
It was always going to move at a glacial pace, but I’m starting to think there’s major disagreement amongst the committee on probably multiple subjects. Especially when you have Mets like Lyza & Alan Gerard on the committee who have no issue calling out how ridiculous the ratings process is now.
It was always going to move at a glacial pace, but I’m starting to think there’s major disagreement amongst the committee on probably multiple subjects. Especially when you have Mets like Lyza & Alan Gerard on the committee who have no issue calling out how ridiculous the ratings process is now.
I'd like to see Tim Marshall and Jim Ladue kicked out of the committee entirely. It's not like Marshall needs the employment. He gets plenty of income from HAAG I'm sure. Hell, let those Canadian guys take over. They've certainly proven themselves with some major breakthroughs lately.
As always, good stuff from you @A Guy. I didn’t put 2 and 2 together until you pointed this out that was the same paper you posted recently.
tornado examiner
Member
Let's not forget the Whitman Nebraska tornado when it comes to potential upgrades based on forensic analysis. A bump to low end EF4 would be warranted for that one if anything measurable was found.
I actually always thought LaDue was very reasonable.
N0mz
Member
He was responsible for one of the worst documents in tornado rating history, his slideshow on the the Birmingham, Goldsby and Chickasha ratings
Alright enough of the silliness against LaDue, etc. I know for a fact that he is one of the proponents of introducing new DIs/etc.
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I'll keep this short and sweet...
That presentation sucks, this isn't news. LaDue isn't perfect. No surveyor is.
But he was one of the first surveyors of the EF scale era to recognize the importance of factoring in contextual, non-traditional DI's to support higher end ratings (think El Reno '11).
tornado examiner
Member
Enderlin’s rating really is a slam dunk for an unconventional EF5 rating and I'm so glad they finally came through and made the proper call.
Winds across the board had to be well into the EF5 range for that train (with so many loaded 230k lb grain hopper cars) to have even tipped over to that extend. Let alone the oil tankers that were lofted. Absolute beast of a tornado.
Winds across the board had to be well into the EF5 range for that train (with so many loaded 230k lb grain hopper cars) to have even tipped over to that extend. Let alone the oil tankers that were lofted. Absolute beast of a tornado.
Alright Jim stays.
*puts pitchfork away
I admittedly don't know much about him other than seeing his name listed next to Marshall's quite a lot. Who would be in charge of greenlighting some retroactive analysis of previous tornadoes anyways? I wonder what the mood is like over at the NSSL.
*puts pitchfork away
I admittedly don't know much about him other than seeing his name listed next to Marshall's quite a lot. Who would be in charge of greenlighting some retroactive analysis of previous tornadoes anyways? I wonder what the mood is like over at the NSSL.
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Kds86z
Member
Is this the first ef5 without TOR-E?
tornado examiner
Member
Uuuuhhh, unless every source under the bus is wrong then
Parkersburg never had one
Nor smithville
Nor joplin
Which is news too me…
Kds86z
Member
Oh yeah duh! My bad. Lol. Joplin definitely didn’t cuz that thing went from 0 to 100 and rain wrapped.