2025 Political Thread

[Mike S]

No… Trump won because the Dems ran a candidate that was as bad as the senile guy that was in office and didn’t acknowledge their failings in the Biden administration and didn’t try to offer a better path. Independents thought DT would be a better choice not knowing he was going to become such a footstool for Russia/Putin and put a fox (Musk) in charge of the henhouse and fill most of his appointments with wackos. I hope I live long enough where the 2 major parties offer us qualified intelligent candidates that value freedom and the Constitution and I won’t have to continue writing in the names of candidates that do

I actually agree with AML - in 2016. Obama spent 8 years telling good people how bad they were, and they grew tired of it. It didn't have to be Trump, but it was.

In 2024, it was pick your poison.

 

[Anti Marine Layer]

I challenge you to go a week posting the good things Trump is doing instead of what’s wrong with the left.
Extra credit if you do it without posting videos, pictures, or other stuff mined from social media.
Extra extra credit if you don’t mention race, gender, sexual orientation, Marx, or fascism.

I'll start today and post stuff the next 7 days

I will get started. No social media tweets or America Thinker articles

Good things Trump has done

Of course, what is good to you is relative to whether you're on the left or the right, but here's a general list of what freedom means for the left vs. the right Sexual libertinism vs. a virtuous population (based on Judeo-Christian values) Mainly positive rights (e.g. free healthcare, free...

talkweather.com

 

[Anti Marine Layer]

 

[Evan]

Welp...

Ironically, I disagree with Sam Seder about MOST things, however, the stunning inability to understand basic facts about how the world works must be embarrassing for MAGA. They managed to dupe a lot of low information voters. Now what? Gotta be careful not to turn the frogs gay.

 

[Evan]

I actually agree with AML - in 2016. Obama spent 8 years telling good people how bad they were, and they grew tired of it. It didn't have to be Trump, but it was.

In 2024, it was pick your poison.

I think Hillary Clinton was uniquely unpopular, and the negative press around her—everything from her health scares to her private server and a plethora of conspiracy theories—pushed enough people into voting third party, sitting the election out, or seeing Trump as a chance to break with the status quo. Jeb Bush, too, was eviscerated—not just by Trump's insults but because people simply didn't want another Bush or Clinton.


Obama was an ineffective and mediocre president (that's me being charitable); however, he left office with an approval rating of about 60%. Since 1952, only a handful of presidents have managed that: Eisenhower, Reagan, Clinton, and Obama. Trump was below 35%. Biden was at 40%. I really don't think Obama was responsible for the Republican Party deciding to overlook a dozen well-qualified candidates and nominate a con man.


Quite frankly, I'd put more blame on traditional media constantly distorting and lying about things (and conservative media engaging in the same behavior once Trump was nominated) than on Obama himself. Obama promised change, didn't deliver on it, and then in 2016, the options were either a throwback to Hillary and the status quo or a man making grandiose promises. That voters believed Trump's BS is largely their own fault, aided and abetted by a media that used Trump for ratings—while continuing to destroy their own credibility—until, suddenly, things got serious, and they said, "You've really got to believe us that this guy is bad news."

I'll throw this out there to really stir the pot:




Not that I have much faith in the accuracy of this one-off poll, however, I do think it shows that Trump wasn't/isn't an inevitability. The Democrats ran candidates in 2016 and 2024 that were badly flawed, didn't focus on issues actually important to voters, and who had zero ability to rebut the GOP's message that the left-wing runs the party and is completely insane. The latter point is more applicable to 2024, but it definitely played a decent role in 2016 as well.

 

[Evan]

Hmmm...looks like either Al Green's "smuggled-in spine" is contagious or Congress has been hearing from people and is beginning to think of the next election:

I'm not sure how much it matters. Congress was absurdly weak with Biden in office as well. Now, with Trump, they have completely abdicated even pretending that they are a co-equal branch. We live in extremely dangerous times. The courts barely held some of Biden's usurpation of power in check. The current admin has been laying groundwork to ignore federal court orders. If they choose to ignore court orders there's no remedy at this point.

 

[bjdeming]

If they choose to ignore court orders there's no remedy at this point.

There is: impeachment of the convicted felon man ultimately responsible for that crime, and prosecution of the others, and this time, no fooling around.

As that might include Crown Prince JD, too, it opens up the interesting possibility of another President Johnson from the South

Congress will do it, if the people are alarmed enough -- and no matter how much the nomenklatura and an intimidated and/or cooperative US media try to ignore, soothe, and numb us, we are alarmed.

 

[Mike S]

I think Hillary Clinton was uniquely unpopular, and the negative press around her—everything from her health scares to her private server and a plethora of conspiracy theories—pushed enough people into voting third party, sitting the election out, or seeing Trump as a chance to break with the status quo. Jeb Bush, too, was eviscerated—not just by Trump's insults but because people simply didn't want another Bush or Clinton.


Obama was an ineffective and mediocre president (that's me being charitable); however, he left office with an approval rating of about 60%. Since 1952, only a handful of presidents have managed that: Eisenhower, Reagan, Clinton, and Obama. Trump was below 35%. Biden was at 40%. I really don't think Obama was responsible for the Republican Party deciding to overlook a dozen well-qualified candidates and nominate a con man.


Quite frankly, I'd put more blame on traditional media constantly distorting and lying about things (and conservative media engaging in the same behavior once Trump was nominated) than on Obama himself. Obama promised change, didn't deliver on it, and then in 2016, the options were either a throwback to Hillary and the status quo or a man making grandiose promises. That voters believed Trump's BS is largely their own fault, aided and abetted by a media that used Trump for ratings—while continuing to destroy their own credibility—until, suddenly, things got serious, and they said, "You've really got to believe us that this guy is bad news."

I'll throw this out there to really stir the pot:




Not that I have much faith in the accuracy of this one-off poll, however, I do think it shows that Trump wasn't/isn't an inevitability. The Democrats ran candidates in 2016 and 2024 that were badly flawed, didn't focus on issues actually important to voters, and who had zero ability to rebut the GOP's message that the left-wing runs the party and is completely insane. The latter point is more applicable to 2024, but it definitely played a decent role in 2016 as well.

Hillary certainly contributed to things. Between her and 8 years of Obama, any Republican was going to win. And any Republican other than Trump would have won the popular vote.

 

[Evan]

There is: impeachment of the convicted felon man ultimately responsible for that crime, and prosecution of the others, and this time, no fooling around.

As that might include Crown Prince JD, too, it opens up the interesting possibility of another President Johnson from the South

Congress will do it, if the people are alarmed enough -- and no matter how much the nomenklatura and an intimidated and/or cooperative US media try to ignore, soothe, and numb us, we are alarmed.

No, that is exactly my point. Congress isn't going to do ANYTHING. The CR bill in the House that just passed has a clause that completely abdicates Congressional authority to impose or remove tariffs. They are doing EVERYTHING possible to neuter their own authority and transfer it to the Executive branch.

Impeachment is not a remedy. We saw that after January 6th. They're not going to hold him accountable. Even if they tried, who is going to enforce a Senate conviction and removal? Trump controls the federal security apparatus and the military. What little law enforcement resources that Congress has are no match for the Executive branch.

Look, I'm not saying that Trump will commit high crimes and misdemeanors. Sure, he has done so on several previous occasions, and was impeached for it in bipartisan fashion, but he learned his lesson! He learned that impeachment is a completely toothless thing and that even if it happens again he won't be convicted. If he was convicted -- see my early point about what the Executive branch controls versus what Congress does. He holds all the cards. Why in God's name would he want to follow a court order that he literally doesn't have to follow? No one can make him. Besides...it's an official act. SCOTUS said he has immunity.

The voters decided they wanted to put a King in the White House. Even if they come to regret it there's simply no remedy. If Trump decides not to leave office absolutely no one can do anything about it. Not trying to doomcast here, but much like his cabinet appointments being confirmed, I am just reading what is in front of my own eyes.

 

[Mike S]

Trump has spent the day lying about Thomas Massie.

Basically, you're either a conservative or a Trump supporter. The terms have become mutually exclusive.

 

[bjdeming]

Impeachment is not a remedy. We saw that after January 6th. They're not going to hold him accountable. Even if they tried, who is going to enforce a Senate conviction and removal? Trump controls the federal security apparatus and the military. What little law enforcement resources that Congress has are no match for the Executive branch.

This argument, while very understandable, plays into the oligarchs' hand.

Obfusticate, deny, and babble as they will, Congress cannot resist public pressure to impeach the president in the face of a clear-cut crime of flouting court orders.

We would have something inescapable with which to figuratively hold their toes to the fire unless they acted, and acted decisively.

The earlier Trump impeachment I file, and most of "mah fellow Americans" -- having a Johnson flashback there -- file under "fooling around."

What the oligarchs might be counting on is:

1. The hell-for-leather Boomers being too old to care any more.
2. The younger voters not having enough of a civics background to get over their shock and paralysis about this deniable coup and to protest it (Canada and Europe aren't saying they can no longer trust the US merely because of the Ukraine or a dislike of Trump -- the Old Country has seen this sort of thing many times before).
3. Trump's political base being stupid.
4. Minorities not caring about this "white folks' fight."

#3 might be the key. Whatever else motivates them, these people are truly patriotic, not cynical like the Trumpeteers. They understand checks and balances, as we all do, and many of them must be having doubts about their guys' going too far.

To use one of their own popular tropes:



We must not help the oligarchs by isolating those disillusioned Americans simply because of how they voted in 2024. We want to hear from them today.


As for #4, I haven't forgotten the race riots in Ferguson despite our country having its first black president then and, while BLM might be out of the picture now (don't know, but the Democrats sure didn't care about them in 2024), I am just waiting to see how long and hot this summer might become...

 

[bjdeming]

The path to "clear-cut" leads in this direction.

 

[Anti Marine Layer]

You've got MAGA and you've got the wokerati

Among the wokerati:

• The queer Marxist in Worcester transgender sanctuary city who cries "Our blessings of liberty that countless people have died for are at risk because of the fascists in our government" (What war was it that countless people died fighting for transgender rights)
• The CBS news reporter who said freedom of speech caused the Holocaust
• College students who believe Trump supporters would be more unfriendly to LGBTQ people than Hamas members
• The Harvard student who wrote a paper on how to abolish gender
• The miserable People's March protestors who compare losing their rights to kill their unborn babies to the evils of the Holocaust

 

[Evan]

You've got MAGA and you've got the wokerati

Among the wokerati:

• The queer Marxist in Worcester transgender sanctuary city who cries "Our blessings of liberty that countless people have died for are at risk because of the fascists in our government" (What war was it that countless people died fighting for transgender rights)
• The CBS news reporter who said freedom of speech caused the Holocaust
• College students who believe Trump supporters would be more unfriendly to LGBTQ people than Hamas members
• The Harvard student who wrote a paper on how to abolish gender
• The miserable People's March protestors who compare losing their rights to kill their unborn babies to the evils of the Holocaust

Guess you couldn't meet the challenge you were given.

 

[Evan]

This argument, while very understandable, plays into the oligarchs' hand.

Obfusticate, deny, and babble as they will, Congress cannot resist public pressure to impeach the president in the face of a clear-cut crime of flouting court orders.

We would have something inescapable with which to figuratively hold their toes to the fire unless they acted, and acted decisively.

The earlier Trump impeachment I file, and most of "mah fellow Americans" -- having a Johnson flashback there -- file under "fooling around."

What the oligarchs might be counting on is:

1. The hell-for-leather Boomers being too old to care any more.
2. The younger voters not having enough of a civics background to get over their shock and paralysis about this deniable coup and to protest it (Canada and Europe aren't saying they can no longer trust the US merely because of the Ukraine or a dislike of Trump -- the Old Country has seen this sort of thing many times before).
3. Trump's political base being stupid.
4. Minorities not caring about this "white folks' fight."

#3 might be the key. Whatever else motivates them, these people are truly patriotic, not cynical like the Trumpeteers. They understand checks and balances, as we all do, and many of them must be having doubts about their guys' going too far.

To use one of their own popular tropes:



We must not help the oligarchs by isolating those disillusioned Americans simply because of how they voted in 2024. We want to hear from them today.


As for #4, I haven't forgotten the race riots in Ferguson despite our country having its first black president then and, while BLM might be out of the picture now (don't know, but the Democrats sure didn't care about them in 2024), I am just waiting to see how long and hot this summer might become...

I think your take is naive. It's not 1988 anymore. It's not 2001 anymore. The country is NOT united. We're happy to experience misery and suffering on an extreme level. Rioting on the streets? It's for the activist class and they're demoralized. If Amazon Prime is still making deliveries the average person doesn't care.

 

[bjdeming]

Some grownups are still hanging in there :

Ukraine has said it is ready to accept an immediate 30-day ceasefire with Russia proposed by the US, after a day of US-Ukraine talks in Saudi Arabia.

US Secretary of State Marco Rubio said he would present the offer to Russia and that "the ball is in their court".

Ukraine's President Volodomyr Zelensky said it was now up to the US to convince Russia to agree to the "positive" proposal.

Tuesday's talks in Jeddah were the first official meeting between the two countries since the extraordinary clash between Zelensky and US President Donald Trump in the Oval Office.

In a joint statement, the US also said it would immediately restart intelligence sharing and security assistance to Ukraine, which Washington had suspended after the unprecedented meeting...

-- Source

 

[bjdeming]

I think your take is naive. It's not 1988 anymore. It's not 2001 anymore. The country is NOT united. We're happy to experience misery and suffering on an extreme level. Rioting on the streets? It's for the activist class and they're demoralized. If Amazon Prime is still making deliveries the average person doesn't care.

Being naive to decadence isn't a bad thing but point taken. I think you're being unnecessarily gloomy, but it's up to those with a long-term future here to build it for themselves between now and 2076.

They're out there but, for the moment, quiet.

Prediction -- they'll build it in the middle, between my pollyanna-ism and your expressed despair.

 

[Anti Marine Layer]

Guess you couldn't meet the challenge you were given.

Oh well. It's not a school assignment.

I challenge anyone here to go for a week posting good things Biden has done and not complain about MAGA or Trump or Musk.

 

[Evan]

Oh well. It's not a school assignment.

I challenge anyone here to go for a week posting good things Biden has done and not complain about MAGA or Trump or Musk.

But we don't like or care about Biden.

 

[Anti Marine Layer]

But we don't like or care about Biden.

I can't say I love Trump either, but he fights harder against the left than any other Republican and the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

King David committed murder and adultery and yet he was considered to be the best king of Israel. Today he'd be cancelled by the left if he were a Republican and admired by the left if he became a Democrat.