Archive 2017-2019 Political Thread

[KoD]

Congress and the president should pass the spending bill agreed upon over a month ago, with a caveat that says they have two months to figure out a border security package. If they don't, the spending bill will enact with the $5.7b for the border wall for Republicans, and something that Democrats want that Republicans would otherwise never agree to. That way each party would have no choice but to come to a resolution or they both lose. Random example, $5.7b border wall & $5.7b additional funds to Planned Parenthood. Reopen the government, force both sides to make concessions or else.

 

[Kory]

Can the Church start excommunicating openly pro-abortion government officials? I feel Cuomo should be the first candidate...

 

[skelly]

I feel like it would be warranted given the extreme stance that many high profile Catholics in political office have taken. Esp. like this latest NY State legislation...

 

[Evan]

Can the Church start excommunicating openly pro-abortion government officials? I feel Cuomo should be the first candidate...

They absolutely should, but I'm not going to hold my breath for it to happen. Just as Pentecostal church's should disfellowship Protestants guilty of the same.

 

[Evan]

Trump Derangement Syndrome is real. Looks at how the media (Washington Post, New York Times, The Atlantic, etc) handled the MAGA hat wearing high schoolers interacting with the Native American veteran. The media has moved past destroying just adults. It is kids now. The media is itching to concoct a story of Trump fueled hated by white, Christian males...that they go as far as completely ignoring all video evidence and eyewitness accounts. The mere sight of white conservatives fuel so much visceral hate from the left.

It is horrifying to see how fast the Catholic diocese condemned this and is willing to punish kids without actual investigation. I'd like to see how fast they responded to accusations of pedophile, rapist priests in their diocese. Probably not at all.

I don't doubt that some in the media have it in for Christians, Conservatives, or anyone marching against abortion in the March For Life. I also think that some of them realized their mistake after additional video came out, but continued to rail against the kids for a variety of factors too long to list here.

But the MSM weren't the only ones snowed by the initial video. Plenty of dyed-in-the-wool Conservatives also condemned the kids before additional video was uncovered.

This mistake shouldn't have ever occurred, but this is one of the principal downsides of social media and the internet. This is not a phenomenon unique to the MSM or liberals. Unfortunately, I see similar behavior occur quite frequently among supposed Conservative personalities, news sources, etc. There's a simple reason (outside of how social media encourages rumor spreading and mobs) for why this keeps happening. It's called Cognitive Bias.

Most of us are biased toward information and news content in SOME way. A lot of people make their judgments and decisions long before they actually review the actual content of a story. There's a significant chunk of people out there who only read the headlines, only read information/news that confirms to their worldview, etc.

Partisanship and the increased social divide in this country has only increased the isolation that many Americans are willingly putting themselves into. Whether liberal or Conservative, an unfortunate number of people have voluntarily chosen to live their lives in an information bubble. They don't read content from a wide array of sources - - they choose to only read content and information that reinforces the narrative that already believe to be true. It's as much of a problem for the New Yorker that only reads liberals/progressive news sources as it is for the MAGA guy who sticks to reading news sources that have a Pro-Trump right-wing viewpoint.

We're fooling ourselves if we think this is isolated to one side or the other. On a daily basis, I find myself almost going insane as I read the inherently biased opinions and thoughts of BOTH SIDES, that are so enmeshed in their cognitive bias and slanted news bubble, that they cannot even conceive of someone holding a different opinion, unless that person is a "right-wing nutjob" or a "libtard."

Granted, the Covington Catholic story was an especially egregious case of bias and hostility towards Conservative Christians. But, shortly before it occurred, we had the hysterical news stories pushed by certain sites that claimed "prayer rugs" were found near the border. That, too, was an excellent example of cognitive bias and media rumor that pushed a false narrative to millions of people.

When the Covington Catholic story first broke, I held my tongue because I saw so many breathless takes and inflammatory claims without any context provided. I know I'm an outlier, but I don't do outrage mobs or rush to judgment no matter the content or story. Not even when it pertains to Trump.

This is such a prevalent problem in today's world that I look for multiple confirmations, firsthand accounts, and hard evidence presented alongside context and possible contradictions. If that's not available then I wait before forming an opinion. Especially when things sound "too good to be true."

I pride myself on reading multiple sources and also looking at contradictory sources - - including the dreaded "other side." I want to understand how they see things, any problems they've indentified, and obviously see any hard evidence that they've uncovered that rebuts or casts doubt on a claim or story.

I'm not foolish enough to believe that most people are going to be that careful, or even that able to control their cognitive bias. All I can do is try my best to not be a part of that problem. So, before you share that outrageous news story, click re-tweet, or email the latest outrage to your family/friends, do a little digging first. Can you verify it elsewhere? Is anyone reputable casting doubt on its claims? Does it sound too good to be true? Does it appeal to your view of the world, or how you see the "other side?"

As tragic as the Covington Catholic story is, it isn't even the first example this year of people's lives being ruined by embellished, false, or fabricated claims. This is the world we now live in, and unless you do your part, it will get worse.

 

[Evan]

First, this wasn't about Trump. Not this time. This was about the March for Life and the media not wanting to cover the story. Instead, they created one out of whole cloth -- anything to keep from having to cover the real story -- and these kids were easy targets. The fact they wore MAGA hats was icing. As far as the Diocese and the school's immediate response, yes, it was knee-jerk. But the Diocese and the school were working under the assumption that the media is an honest medium and the video was accurate. It's hard for people to wrap the heads around the fact that the media are bold-faced liars. People still assume that the media are basically honest journalists just 'telling the story'. But the truth is more often than not the media is telling a story. I believe the Diocese and the school have been set back on their heels if they read the boy's response (seen in the video by the media) as to what happened. The full two-hour video matches up to his accounting of facts. Can't say the same for the supposed victim the media tried to make out of the native American over the weekend. Not that the media cares. They already knew the truth before going forward with the story. And that's what should disgust everyone with any sense of decency. That video was cropped and edited - they knew. These boys are 15/16 years old. If anyone is a victim here - it's these Catholic Christian school boys. And I dare anyone to challenge me on it. The media can go pound sand.

As for your comment, Kory, about the Catholic Church, please refer to my comments above. I'm sure the Diocese feels awful for trusting a news story. The Catholic Church is made of men. They will screw up. Let's not condemn the whole institution for it.

The egregious thing about the Covington Catholic story was the doubling and tripling down by numerous media outlets once contradictory video came to light. Without a shadow of a doubt, there were members of the media that deliberately ignored the exculpatory video and evidence that came to light after their initial rush to judgment.

But, I also saw a significant number of journalists that simply could NOT see through their own cognitive bias, and were unable to assess the new evidence with neutrality.

I'm not sure what's worse - - deliberate lying, or being so biased that you can't see clearly contradictory evidence in high-resolution video.

Zero question that bias against Christians and Conservatives reared its ugly head in a systemic way throughout the MSM.

As I alluded to in my response to Kory, part of this issue is caused by the popularity of social media and changes in how people consume news. Clickbait stories, hot takes, and controversial topics drive more traffic than any longform piece on a serious topic would ever bring.

Americans have become increasingly myopic, stupid, and focused on outrage that confirms their view of the world.

I've posted this before, in regards to how awful our modern day politicians are, but politicians (like the media) are a reflection of our society as a whole. We could debate how much the media drives society versus society driving the content fed to us by the media, but there's no denying that the media gives audiences what it craves.

Until the American people become serious again about our culture, our lifestyles, and our faith, we will continue to descend into the wickedness of the world. We're giving Sodom and Gomorrah a run for their money.

For what it's worth, I disagree that this wasn't about Trump. The MAGA hats that the teenagers were wearing served as a proxy for the hatred and loathing many people feel towards Trump. If they'd all been wearing Notre Dame hats this controversy likely would've barely made the news (if it even did).

Part of what made the cognitive bias so strong in this case is the symbolism of the MAGA hat. While I believe that is totally unfair and foolish, not to mention counter-productive, we cannot deny that MAGA hats evoke a lot of strong feelings. Trump chose the MAGA hat to represent himself and his campaign long ago, so a lot of people see a MAGA hat as saying "I agree with everything Trump does and says." Again, not saying that's fair or sensible, particularly when it pertains to teenagers, but that's the reality of how a significant chunk of society views someone that wears a MAGA hat.

Finally, I previously referenced the breakdown of American culture, our immoral lifestyles, our irreligiousness, and our preference for unserious news and entertainment. I know you shared my concerns about Trump, so is it really any surprise at all that the aforementioned factors are peaking after we elected him President? We elected someone who is immoral, irreligiousness, and unserious, and many of our political, religious, and societal leaders mortgaged their souls to make it happen.

America is a rudderless ship sailing into the abyss. It's the biggest reality show ever produced with Trump as the Captain, Americans as the passengers, and the rest of the world serving as the live studio audience. At least we'll all be entertained.

 

[skelly]

Ok I’ll bite on your theory as I can agree on large part. The Cognitive Disonance if you will is giving some the benefit of the doubt and handing them somewhat of an excuse of invincible ignorance which I feel they are not deserving. There has been a decent amount of willful deception. If you want to say on both sides then so be it.

 

[Kory]

Pretty big developments overnight.

 

[skelly]

Pretty big developments overnight.

Can the special council speak to Julian Assange or has he been ceremoniously buried at sea?

 

[Kory]

Things are spiraling out of control in communist Venezuela...Bernie Sanders’ dream country! After all, he said Venezuela is more apt to enjoy the American dream!

 

[Kory]

AHAHAHAHAH Trump caved. He's done for 2020. Does this not remind you of "read my lips...no new taxes?"

Democrats couldn't be in a better position come 2020.

 

[ghost]

AHAHAHAHAH Trump caved. He's done for 2020. Does this not remind you of "read my lips...no new taxes?"

Democrats couldn't be in a better position come 2020.

Maybe... maybe not. They can still screw it up royally by running a socialist for POTUS

 

[skelly]

Maybe... maybe not. They can still screw it up royally by running a socialist for POTUS

That’s all they have that I know about.

 

[ghost]

That’s all they have that I know about.

I don't think of Biden or Beto in the same socialist vein as Sanders or Cortez. I think they could pull some Never Trump Repubs and Indy votes where Sanders and Cortez wouldn't.

 

[KoD]

Reopening government the same day Roger Stone gets arrested.
Interesting timing.

 

[skelly]

I don't think of Biden or Beto in the same socialist vein as Sanders or Cortez. I think they could pull some Never Trump Repubs and Indy votes where Sanders and Cortez wouldn't.

Biden not running. They’re already targeting Beto as white privileged. They’re pretty certain that Florida is flipped blue.

 

[warneagle]

This is the only politics post I'll ever do but I'm glad the government is back open so I can get paid and I really hope we don't have to do this again next month...

 

[Mike S]

Reopening government the same day Roger Stone gets arrested.
Interesting timing.

I absolutely believe this is why Trump caved today.

 

[gangstonc]

I absolutely believe this is why Trump caved today.

I think it was the LaGuardia issues. His billionaire New York buddies couldn’t get their planes out when they wanted to vacation this weekend.

 

[Kory]

I figured he reopened the government so they had someone who could collect the mailed in bump stocks that were banned.