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maroonedinhsv

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I miss 2004 when youtube was ad free, iirc I switched to YouTube from a competing video hosting site because of there was no ads and the video data cap was higher than anyone else. It's changed a lot, their feed is garbage too. Around 35-45% of videos they recommend to me are videos I've already watched and no matter how many times I say "Not interested > I've already watched this video" it just persists indefinitely. Been like that for years too.
As one of the "old farts" that has been around since the beginning of the web, this has always been the struggle. Many people created websites for the good of the community, with no intention of profiting on its existence. As websites grew in popularity, the costs went up (more storage, more bandwidth, etc). Eventually, popular free websites would be too costly to run without a source of income, so the options were paid membership or ads. For most sites, paid membership just didn't work, because their was always another site promising the same thing for free (or most members more than happy to live with whatever the reduced capabilities of the free membership were). The better path from a financial standpoint was always to build up a user base large enough that it would be difficult for another new site to steal all of your users, then do one of two things - introduce ads, or sell to one of the giant web companies (and let them introduce ads).

As I'm sure @WesL can tell you, when it comes to hosting a website, there is no free lunch.
 
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TH2002

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But you said

If the statistics show that users are increasing, how are those poor decisions from a business perspective? They may be driving some people to other platforms, but net positive growth sounds like they’re making the right decisions to me.

I will concede that it is evolving, but that is almost required in the tech world. Sites that don’t evolve are the ones that actually die.
Literally the entire YT creator community was against the integration with Google+ back in 2013. They did it anyway.
Literally the entire YT creator community didn't support the "ad-friendly" video guidelines. They implemented them anyway.
Literally the entire YT creator community (including Jawed Karim himself) were against the removal of dislikes. They did it anyway.

And there's countless other examples...

Of course these decisions are good from a business perspective; after all, the vast majority of the most subscribed "YouTubers" are actually corporations these days. The reason there hasn't been a net loss of users is because YouTube, although now a shell of its former self still holds a de facto monopoly in the longer form video sharing market. Facebook Watch is the only other site that comes close in terms of popularity (Facebook is more popular overall, but video sharing isn't what it's primarily known for).
 

maroonedinhsv

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Literally the entire YT creator community was against the integration with Google+ back in 2013. They did it anyway.
Literally the entire YT creator community didn't support the "ad-friendly" video guidelines. They implemented them anyway.
Literally the entire YT creator community (including Jawed Karim himself) were against the removal of dislikes. They did it anyway.

And there's countless other examples...

Of course these decisions are good from a business perspective; after all, the vast majority of the most subscribed "YouTubers" are actually corporations these days. The reason there hasn't been a net loss of users is because YouTube, although now a shell of its former self still holds a de facto monopoly in the longer form video sharing market. Facebook Watch is the only other site that comes close in terms of popularity (Facebook is more popular overall, but video sharing isn't what it's primarily known for).
Why do you think it holds a de facto monopoly?
 

TH2002

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Why do you think it holds a de facto monopoly?
Because they have basically no competition in the longer form video sharing market. The closest competitor (Dailymotion) is an extremely distant second (2.6 billion active users for YouTube vs 300 million for Dailymotion) so I think it's fair to say they hold a monopoly in the space.
 

maroonedinhsv

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Because they have basically no competition in the longer form video sharing market. The closest competitor (Dailymotion) is an extremely distant second (2.6 billion active users for YouTube vs 300 million for Dailymotion) so I think it's fair to say they hold a monopoly in the space.
I’m not asking for the definition of a monopoly. I’m asking WHY ( in your opinion) they have a monopoly?
 

TH2002

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I’m not asking for the definition of a monopoly. I’m asking WHY ( in your opinion) they have a monopoly?
Because YouTube was the only viable choice for content creators for so long, and it's STILL the only viable choice for longer-form content. As one of my favorite creators (EmpLemon) put it, "Unless you want your stuff to be seen by more than a dozen people, it's YouTube or bust".

Unless the question is why people chose to upload their footage to YouTube instead of other sites. It was the place to be for quite a few years, and wasn't always as poorly run as it is now. Once Google saw they had a solid user base, they stopped caring knowing they had already killed off any chance people would ditch YT for Vimeo, Dailymotion and other sites.
 

Mike S

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I miss 2004 when youtube was ad free, iirc I switched to YouTube from a competing video hosting site because of there was no ads and the video data cap was higher than anyone else. It's changed a lot, their feed is garbage too. Around 35-45% of videos they recommend to me are videos I've already watched and no matter how many times I say "Not interested > I've already watched this video" it just persists indefinitely. Been like that for years too.

my ad blocker makes Youtube ad free. No video interruptions.
 

KoD

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my ad blocker makes Youtube ad free. No video interruptions.
Likewise, the ads aren't intrusive to me personally. In fact I spend so much time on youtube I just pay them for their service by having a premium membership, it's the least I could do for how much entertainment I derive from the platform. I am more disgruntled with their recommendation feed however. I wish it had an option for a user to customize it or it listened to feedback.
 

Mike S

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Likewise, the ads aren't intrusive to me personally. In fact I spend so much time on youtube I just pay them for their service by having a premium membership, it's the least I could do for how much entertainment I derive from the platform. I am more disgruntled with their recommendation feed however. I wish it had an option for a user to customize it or it listened to feedback.

I never look at their recommendations. I forget they have them. I'm not really on there that much and they get plenty of money from me via YoutubeTv and of course I've already purchased the NFL Sunday Ticket!

My main reason to ad block them is I have a pretty long playlist that I'll use for background noise at work. I downloaded Firefox on my work computer just for Youtube, mainly just for my playlists, and I put Ad Block plus on it. I do donate to Ad Block plus because I use them at home as well.
 

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I don't do adblockers on YT since that devalues your watch session for the creator, and I want my channels to be successful. My interests there are wide and varied, and in time I've watched as many of my favorites have been defunded based simply on the genre' of their content, even when their stuff only remotely fit the category. Everything "firearms" got defended including Olympic and world target competitions. Dashcam videos got defunded even if they didn't show injurious crashes, and if one shows where a death occured(visible in the vid or not) chances are good that thecreator wil have the vid pulled and the channel suspended or banned. Tornado vids are just the same. Videos concerning the raising or use of animals for the purpose of eating get defunded. Vids of "bushcrafting" have been lumped in with "survivalists' which are defunded even though bushcrafting has an entirely different focus.

Bad that much of YT's actions against creators seems to be automatic (or nearly so) based on algorithms which does not get or have human oversight. Worst of all is that questions or complaints about an action are either not answered or arbitrarily increase the actions taken against creators, and the causes for such actions to be taken in the first place are more based on someone's objective personal liking or disliking than for any logical reason. From what used to be a very freely expressed environment, YouTube has turned into censorship nazis solely because they can do it and nobody can do anything about it. And sadly there is no other vidshare platform which even comes close to the number of potential viewers YT has. The few creators I know who have attempted to abandoned YT have failed or are failing the attempt because there's not enough income potential anywhere else.

Social media like TikTok, Facebook, and Twitter are better for casual creators and shorter vids so that's where you find most of that kind of content now. YT created their "Shorts" category in hope of fighting that off and taking over that category of vid too but they've discovered that this kind of creator usually isn't interested in making a YT vid at all since the9ir intended audience isn't there. Younger generations are more focused on using socail media and not vidshare specific sites like YT. So I too see YouTube as dying for it certainly is since it's growth no longer paces the growth of new internet users while the so9cia media platforms are running well ahead of that point. Heck, even forums are dying compared to chatrooms, reddit, facebook, and Twitter groups, etc. It's over for YT as it was and as it is now.
 
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JayF

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I don't do adblockers on YT since that devalues your watch session for the creator, and I want my channels to be successful. My interests there are wide and varied, and in time I've watched as many of my favorites have been defunded based simply on the genre' of their content, even when their stuff only remotely fit the category. Everything "firearms" got defended including Olympic and world target competitions. Dashcam videos got defunded even if they didn't show injurious crashes, and if one shows where a death occured(visible in the vid or not) chances are good that thecreator wil have the vid pulled and the channel suspended or banned. Tornado vids are just the same. Videos concerning the raising or use of animals for the purpose of eating get defunded. Vids of "bushcrafting" have been lumped in with "survivalists' which are defunded even though bushcrafting has an entirely different focus.

Bad that much of YT's actions against creators seems to be automatic (or nearly so) based on algorithms which does not get or have human oversight. Worst of all is that questions or complaints about an action are either not answered or arbitrarily increase the actions taken against creators, and the causes for such actions to be taken in the first place are more based on someone's objective personal liking or disliking than for any logical reason. From what used to be a very freely expressed environment, YouTube has turned into censorship nazis solely because they can do it and nobody can do anything about it. And sadly there is no other vidshare platform which even comes close to the number of potential viewers YT has. The few creators I know who have attempted to abandoned YT have failed or are failing the attempt because there's not enough income potential anywhere else.

Social media like TikTok, Facebook, and Twitter are better for casual creators and shorter vids so that's where you find most of that kind of content now. YT created their "Shorts" category in hope of fighting that off and taking over that category of vid too but they've discovered that this kind of creator usually isn't interested in making a YT vid at all since the9ir intended audience isn't there. Younger generations are more focused on using socail media and not vidshare specific sites like YT. So I too see YouTube as dying for it certainly is since it's growth no longer paces the growth of new internet users while the so9cia media platforms are running well ahead of that point. Heck, even forums are dying compared to chatrooms, reddit, facebook, and Twitter groups, etc. It's over for YT as it was and as it is now.

The problem I find with Reddit, Facebook, Twitter, and TikTok is there is still no ad revenue sharing with the creators. Until people stop posting stuff to those sites until they start paying the creators, they may find themselves struggling to keep viewers. those creators that I know that use those platforms, use them to bring others to their longform content on YT. YouTube though is struggling to keep an active user or ad base. Some creators on YT are witnessing a 90% decrease in Ad Revenue. It is because they are going to the other short form providers and they charge less because they are not sharing that revenue.
 

bjdeming

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The problem I find with Reddit, Facebook, Twitter, and TikTok is there is still no ad revenue sharing with the creators
I've been noticing that Twitter recently started featuring creators in their "You might want to follow" thing.

I haven't followed it up because I'm migrating into Mastodon (Sunny.Garden instance) though still keeping a bit of a presence on Twitter, where there are some very interesting people and still lots of science-based agencies issuing alerts, etc., via Twitter (Italy's INGV , for example). Plus every now and then someone follows me, which is always nice :)

But does this Twitter move re: creators address what you're concerned about?
 

akt1985

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I can’t believe CBS televised the University of Miami football team paying the Colorado School of Mines half a million to stomp all over them on a Sunday afternoon no less.
 

TH2002

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Outside of looking for tornado videos, until I find a way to circumvent this nonsense, YT has seen its last view from me
youtubeshite.jpg
 

TH2002

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And, if you're blocking their ads, they're perfectly fine with that.
As am I. Given that YT has been cherrypicking and promoting content produced by corporations (as opposed to actual creators) for years now, it’s clear that they don’t want viewers like myself around anymore anyway, regardless if I block the ads or not.
 

bjdeming

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I guess they want people like me, who pay the premium upgrade. I didn't want to at first, and I really am not thrilled about their being owned by a monolith that did away with its "Don't Be Evil" motto a long time ago, but I need the service YT provides for my work and enjoy listening to music playlists in my off time, so I decided to feed the machine.

Too bad there aren't more alternatives. I check Vimeo sometimes, and there are probably others. Archive.org is an option, too.
 

TH2002

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I guess they want people like me, who pay the premium upgrade. I didn't want to at first, and I really am not thrilled about their being owned by a monolith that did away with its "Don't Be Evil" motto a long time ago, but I need the service YT provides for my work and enjoy listening to music playlists in my off time, so I decided to feed the machine.

Too bad there aren't more alternatives. I check Vimeo sometimes, and there are probably others. Archive.org is an option, too.
Music, looking for tornado footage and keeping up with the few creators I like that still upload are really all I use YT for these days - though for music I have Spotify and other options, thank goodness.

Although, most new tornado footage (apart from chaser footage) seems to be uploaded to Facebook Watch these days, while Dailymotion mostly consists of unauthorized uploads of movies and TV shows/dramas (but hey, it’s free…)

Vimeo is mostly professionally-produced content from what I can tell. Odysee is a mix of YT creators who maintain mirror channels there, and political expats kicked from other platforms.
 
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