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Enhanced Fujita Ratings Debate Thread

joshoctober16 said:
View attachment 31017
mayfeild had some bad ones as well , here is a home with the whole roof gone and most outer walls down , rated as a threshold of visible damage EF0 65 mph .... and theres like 2-3 photos of this di ...

then from a different tornado from the same day is this mid EF2 only damage
View attachment 31018
View attachment 31019
Click to expand...
I was always aware of the ground level photo of the second DI, but I had never seen the aerial before and wow...

That for me personally is probably the most egregious example of damage rating I can recall - easily EF4 level damage I would argue (some granulation, wind rowing, tree damage, clean slab (brick construction), and to give that an EF2 rating is crazy. Thanks for sharing.
 


Seen some people online saying that Joshua Wurman is trying to make a case for Greenfield being rated EF5 based on radar data and photogrammetry of Reed's footage as seen above. Just a rumour but interesting nonetheless, doubt it will go anywhere though.
 
UK_EF4 said:


Seen some people online saying that Joshua Wurman is trying to make a case for Greenfield being rated EF5 based on radar data and photogrammetry of Reed's footage as seen above. Just a rumour but interesting nonetheless, doubt it will go anywhere though.
Click to expand...

a tornado that should have photogrammetry is this one

if you look closely you even see it throw a car on to the road and a whole power pole is seen flying super fast from left to right.
 
joshoctober16 said:
a tornado that should have photogrammetry is this one

if you look closely you even see it throw a car on to the road and a whole power pole is seen flying super fast from left to right.
Click to expand...

That's one of my favorite tornado vids- so much debris circulating and being thrown with such a clear view of what it all is. And a whole mature tree, foliage, rootball, and all just going round and round.
 
UK_EF4 said:


Seen some people online saying that Joshua Wurman is trying to make a case for Greenfield being rated EF5 based on radar data and photogrammetry of Reed's footage as seen above. Just a rumour but interesting nonetheless, doubt it will go anywhere though.
Click to expand...


If the DOW team could find some stationary footage of the tornadoes they've scanned, it'd be very easy to confirm their readings at ground level as long as two important conditions are met: 1. The footage is stabilized so there's no camera motion at all. 2. An identifiable object is thrown.

From there you could easily devise a tracking system to figure the exact speed the object was moving.

the only problem with Greenfield is very few people have footage of it. I'm pretty sure the tornado that hit Greenfield and the tornado in Reed's footage are separate tornadoes.

This guy managed to capture it simply because he was in the wrong place at the right time.

This guy also captured it on accident.
 
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Something I just recently noticed and was never mentioned in here is all these slabbed homes from Vilonia were brick.

April_27,_2014_Vilonia_tornado_aerial_damage.jpgGKwp3PxW4AAeQim.jpg

Honestly insane. Look at the spread on the debris. The houses are GONE in the same way Bridge Creek, Jarell, Smithville, etc. houses were gone. Then there's these seven houses.

GKwrIvTWIAAGQv2.jpg

Where is everything?! it's mind blowing. Everything is just... gone... including the grass.

unknown (1).png

"Ratings are not normally assigned based on only one structure."
 
joshoctober16 said:
a tornado that should have photogrammetry is this one

if you look closely you even see it throw a car on to the road and a whole power pole is seen flying super fast from left to right.
Click to expand...



joshoctober16 said:

longer video of this

elie could be a other good one since you litterly see the F5 damage happen on camera....
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These are great! Videos like this of tornadoes the DOW has successfully scanned would be perfect. Here's one from Minden Iowa. the Dow recorded 220 MPH winds at a width of 1000 meters or something crazy.

 
Grand Poo Bah said:
Something I just recently noticed and was never mentioned in here is all these slabbed homes from Vilonia were brick.

View attachment 31047View attachment 31045

Honestly insane. Look at the spread on the debris. The houses are GONE in the same way Bridge Creek, Jarell, Smithville, etc. houses were gone. Then there's these seven houses.

View attachment 31046

Where is everything?! it's mind blowing. Everything is just... gone... including the grass.

View attachment 31048

"Ratings are not normally assigned based on only one structure."
Click to expand...
outline of these 2 areas
1729104227142.png
1729104190770.png
1729104151275.png
 
Grand Poo Bah said:
Then there's these seven houses.

View attachment 31046

Where is everything?! it's mind blowing. Everything is just... gone... including the grass.
Click to expand...

The lack of debris in that case is due to post-storm cleanup, but the original scene is no less remarkable:
resized_30160-btornado069_19-18289_t1000-jpeg.12070

716eaba244ddac11eb30651cbd958b0e-jpg.6407


The home in the second photo was allegedly well-constructed as well
 
Speaking of Vilonia, this is the only ground level view of that neighborhood just completely obliterated:
video

Btw if its not loading, search up “vilonia tornado 2014 damage” and it should appear.
 
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Tomcats Forever! said:
Why are debris impacts used to downgrade a rating anyway? It's a violent tornado- there's gonna be debris impacts.
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ya its pretty much impossible for homes to not be hit by debris....

while the whole bassfield truck hitting into the home was one thing.... the bowling green getting hit by other home debris is used to rate a brick home being swept clean as.... mid EF2 .... is overdoing it way too much.
unknown (2).png
could of sworn it was like 123 mph or something like that...
 
joshoctober16 said:
ya its pretty much impossible for homes to not be hit by debris....

while the whole bassfield truck hitting into the home was one thing.... the bowling green getting hit by other home debris is used to rate a brick home being swept clean as.... mid EF2 .... is overdoing it way too much.
View attachment 31052
could of sworn it was like 123 mph or something like that...
Click to expand...
just to be extra sure i went to check this damage out and its ... 1729115065981.png
1729115092273.png
120 ... or 130 mph rated .... so lower and or higher then i thought
 
for some reason it says exterior walls collapsed....
but it clearly seems swept clean , even moores so call EF5 damage is less swept clean then this home, also...
1729115326836.png
the lowest you can go is 145 mph .... and they state 120 or 130 mph....

this damage point , along with the so call only 65 mph EF0 damage of a home with its whole roof gone and most walls down.... should be fixed.
 
Josh Wurman and Jim Ladue just give a speech today and they reveals more interesting data of Greenfield when it went through town
20241022_064830.jpg
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It's quite unexpected to me that the strongest winds of 309-318mph occurred between SE 3th street and SE 4th street where all houses here was given EF3 rating with the particular one house sustained strongest winds not being swept clean from its foundation.
20241022_064907.jpg
20241022_065426.jpg20241022_065456.jpgIMG_20241022_074019.jpgIMG_20241022_074611.jpgIt's easy to tell that DOW-derived wind didnt match well with damage in town. Strongest damage was ahead of where strongest wind occurred.
They also mentioned that the highest rating DI could rated differently in new EF scale.
20241022_065244.jpg
20241022_065221.jpg
Really hope to see more detailed data and information from them.
 
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