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Political Thread (20 Viewers)


ghost

Member
PerryW Project Supporter
Messages
508
Location
NW AL
Saw this posted on another site and it makes too much sense to me....
"Border apprehensions are at 40 year low, down from a peak of 1.6 million in 2000 to 300K in 2017, and yet somehow, there's a "crisis" that warrants a "national emergency" to build a 30 foot high, 2,000 mile long wall that will costs tens of billions of dollars and take years to complete, which does absolutely ZERO for the so called "emergency" that exists TODAY."
 

Matt

Member
Messages
1,377
Location
Alabaster
Good lord! If you think about the probable cause it took to start this, it’s terrifying.

You're an incorrect. Over policy differences the top tier people at the FBI launch an investigation as retribution for Trump firing Comey. This is alarming and further illustrates how corrupt the DOJ and FBI have become(at least at the top). Obama, Holder, Lynch ,et al should be in jail for hat they did and did not do. I don't think it ends well for them but in this political climate who the hell knows.
 
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Messages
24
Location
California
You're an idiot! Over policy differences the top tier people at the FBI launch an investigation as retribution for Trump firing Comey. This is alarming and further illustrates how corrupt the DOJ and FBI have become(at least at the top). Obama, Holder, Lynch ,et al should be in jail for hat they did and did not do. I don't think it ends well for them but in this political climate who the hell knows.
Ah yes, the personal attack. For when you have no true rebuttal.

Do you have any idea how many times I have wanted to call you an idiot in the last few months? You are a Trump apologist through and through.

Get over yourself and actually find evidence that refutes gangstonc! Don't be lazy!
 
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Messages
24
Location
California
I'm not so sure. I think they're attempting to follow the Trump model - Go to the extreme in an attempt to rally one segment of the population and expect all of the party to fall in line.
You might be right in their motives, but they do not fall in line like the Republicans. Their message control and focus is not as refined as the Republicans. Republicans chip away to get what they want and are very disciplined. Democrats ought to try that. They have demographics and time on their side.
 

Jacob

Member
Messages
308
Location
Moody, AL
You might be right in their motives, but they do not fall in line like the Republicans. Their message control and focus is not as refined as the Republicans. Republicans chip away to get what they want and are very disciplined. Democrats ought to try that. They have demographics and time on their side.
What’s funny about politics, you could type this exact message, but swap Republicans and Democrats, and just as many people would feel it was true.
 

gangstonc

Member
Messages
1,794
Location
Meridianville
You're an idiot! Over policy differences the top tier people at the FBI launch an investigation as retribution for Trump firing Comey. This is alarming and further illustrates how corrupt the DOJ and FBI have become(at least at the top). Obama, Holder, Lynch ,et al should be in jail for hat they did and did not do. I don't think it ends well for them but in this political climate who the hell knows.
Well... that’s inappropriate. It’s a good thing I don’t get upset. You should be smarter than to call somebody you don’t know names.
 

Kory

Member
Messages
3,036
Location
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
Saw this posted on another site and it makes too much sense to me....
"Border apprehensions are at 40 year low, down from a peak of 1.6 million in 2000 to 300K in 2017, and yet somehow, there's a "crisis" that warrants a "national emergency" to build a 30 foot high, 2,000 mile long wall that will costs tens of billions of dollars and take years to complete, which does absolutely ZERO for the so called "emergency" that exists TODAY."
This is a gross oversimplification of the problem. What has happened is there is a shift from mostly adult males to now unaccompanied minors and "family units" which have been incredible hot beds for human trafficking into forced labor and the sex industry. I have said it once and I will say it again, what we have going on at our border is a humanitarian crisis. Our current system isn't set up to handle the newest influx of immigrants as it is different than what was seen prior. So yes, number of crossings and apprehensions are lower, but its a DIFFERENT type, which much more vulnerable demographics (women and children).

It is estimated that human traffickers kidnap and force more than 50,000, yes FIFTY-THOUSAND, people per year into forced labor and the sex trade in the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. It is disgusting our politicians have sat around so long and have twiddled their thumbs for so long. Laws protecting victims and enforcement of border security have lagged significantly. But hey, let's continue the name calling by both sides. That should help fix the situation.
 

gangstonc

Member
Messages
1,794
Location
Meridianville
This is a gross oversimplification of the problem. What has happened is there is a shift from mostly adult males to now unaccompanied minors and "family units" which have been incredible hot beds for human trafficking into forced labor and the sex industry. I have said it once and I will say it again, what we have going on at our border is a humanitarian crisis. Our current system isn't set up to handle the newest influx of immigrants as it is different than what was seen prior. So yes, number of crossings and apprehensions are lower, but its a DIFFERENT type, which much more vulnerable demographics (women and children).

It is estimated that human traffickers kidnap and force more than 50,000, yes FIFTY-THOUSAND, people per year into forced labor and the sex trade in the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. It is disgusting our politicians have sat around so long and have twiddled their thumbs for so long. Laws protecting victims and enforcement of border security have lagged significantly. But hey, let's continue the name calling by both sides. That should help fix the situation.
How does a wall help the problem?
 

Kory

Member
Messages
3,036
Location
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
You did not. But that is what this shutdown and "emergency" are centered on.
I'm tired of people thinking there IS NOT a problem with our porous border with Mexico for my reasons stated above. You have that goofball Acosta down there "well there doesn't appear to be a crisis." Tell that to the the 12 year olds being dragged across the border and sold into slavery. Tell that to the illegal immigrants dying in the backs of overheated and cramped refrigerated trucks. Tell that to the ill children dying as their parents drag them across the desert. Tell that to the hundreds of thousands of families who watched their family members die from drug overdoses...where the vast majority come across the Southern border.

I never proposed a solution because I don't have the experience in this nor have I been down there first hand. From what I have read, it will probably take a combination of physical barriers, increased law enforcement, better judicial processes, and intervention (through policy changes) to FIX why they're escaping their violence ridden countries in the first place. I don't think there is a solution to this that excludes even one of the above (and I'm sure there are more). But there is a need for physical barriers. To think there isn't a need for a physical barrier whatsoever...is simply Democrat pandering. I don't think the extent of what Trump wants is needed...let me clarify that. And I believe the lack of leadership while he had a Republican Congress shows he wasn't serious about this. I think this is more "stick it to the Dems" and he knew is presidency was over if he didn't put up a fight.
 
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gangstonc

Member
Messages
1,794
Location
Meridianville
I'm tired of people thinking there IS NOT a problem with our porous border with Mexico for my reasons stated above. You have that goofball Acosta down there "well there doesn't appear to be a crisis." Tell that to the the 12 year olds being dragged across the border and sold into slavery. Tell that to the illegal immigrants dying in the backs of overheated and cramped refrigerated trucks. Tell that to the ill children dying as their parents drag them across the desert. Tell that to the hundreds of thousands of families who watched their family members die from drug overdoses...where the vast majority come across the Southern border.

I never proposed a solution because I don't have the experience in this nor have I been down there first hand. From what I have read, it will probably take a combination of physical barriers, increased law enforcement, better judicial processes, and intervention (through policy changes) to FIX why they're escaping their violence ridden countries in the first place. I don't think there is a solution to this that excludes even one of the above (and I'm sure there are more). But there is a need for physical barriers. To think there isn't a need for a physical barrier whatsoever...is simply Democrat pandering. I don't think the extent of what Trump wants is needed...let me clarify that. And I believe the lack of leadership while he had a Republican Congress shows he wasn't serious about this. I think this is more "stick it to the Dems" and he knew is presidency was over if he didn't put up a fight.
I just don’t see how a physical barrier that can be defeated in minutes will do any good. Seems like a tremendous waste of funds, manpower, labor, and materials. Not to mention the land will have to be taken or purchased from many private citizens. I don’t see that going well.
 

gangstonc

Member
Messages
1,794
Location
Meridianville
Imagine you are a FBI Agent working Russian counterintelligence in 2016 and you witness the following:

  • you witnessed Russian hackers targeting a wide swath of Americans including the DNC, DCCC, former Secretary of State & a Presidential candidates staff
  • someone previously targeted by Russian Intelligence joins the Trump campaign and then appears on a stage in Moscow supporting Russia policy and speaking negatively of US policy
  • A Presidential candidate hires a new campaign manager whose not been in the business in the states for years, but has been seen pushing a Russian agenda in Ukraine and has Russian intel contacts
  • an Australian official contacts you and says the Russians have stolen emails of a Presidential candidate & may want to give them to the candidate’s competitor
  • a Russian lawyer & others tied to Russian government visit a Presidential candidate’s son in the candidate’s building in NYC
  • Candidate Trump stands on a stage and calls out Russia and asks about emails from his competitor, says they will be rewarded if they have them and release them
  • website that’s released sensitive & classified documents from US for years, helped deliver a US insider to The Kremlin, begins publishing document & emails during Dem convention, content you know was stolen by Russia. Site administrator once hosted a TV show on Russia State TV
  • A strange, unexpected policy change occurs at RNC convention, the change is a less supportive position toward Ukraine and is advantageous to Russia
  • candidate’s campaign manager goes on CNN and asserts a false terrorist attack in Turkey, one tied to and advanced by Russian propaganda
  • during this time, you watch a campaign associate tweet with a Russian account that’s pointing people to stolen documents from the opposing campaign. The campaign associate predicts something will happen to the opposing campaign manager- his emails are later released
  • as Election Day approaches, Presidential candidate makes allegation, without evidence, voter Fraud & Election Rigging, Russia propaganda echoes this, social media accounts associated Kremlin do the same, at same time, you watch Russian Hackers hit state election infrastructure
  • After election, current President issues sanctions against Russia, but the incoming National Security advisor makes calls to Russian officials from 3rd country, when approached for clarification post inauguration, the advisor lies about contents of phone call w/Russian officials
  • During summer fall leading into the election, you receive raw intelligence from highly reliable source whose proven invaluable on other investigations. source provides intelligence on Russia’s efforts to support a presidential candidate, the info is consistent with other info
  • Before inauguration your bosses, your leaders from all intelligence agencies brief president elect on classified info showing Russia influenced the election on behalf of President elect. President elect rejects intelligence from all your superiors and suggests Russia innocent
  • From the summer of 2015 all the way through the election and after inauguration, you watch as the candidate, president elect and now president offers overt effusive support for Vladimir Putin who you know has been helping the President get elected.
  • Shortly after inauguration, your new commander-in-chief spouts false information about Polish aggression toward Belarus. This is not supported by the Intelligence community you are in, and the only source for this viewpoint is Russian propaganda
  • After firing of National Security Advisor that lies to you agencies investigators, the President corners your boss 1-1 asks him to go easy on National Security Advisor who lies about his conversation with Russians
  • During this period, the President inexplicably and repeatedly asks your boss if he’s under investigation with regards to Russia, despite your boss and other intel heads going out of their way to brief the President about Kremlin efforts to potentially compromise & manipulate him
  • While Congressional committees investigate Russian interference, the President fires your boss for his handling of an email investigation into the President’s opponent, an investigation that helped elevate the President rather than hurt him
  • You later find out a draft memo from President to your boss regarding his firing cited the Russia investigation
  • The President then goes on national television and in an interview says he fired your boss because of the Russia investigation
  • A week after firing your boss, the President invites Russian leaders into the Oval Office, Russian photographers capture the moment, but US media is not allowed to observe. President then brags to Russian leaders about firing your boss
  • Sometime during the spring, if you’re not already aware, you read a news story alleging the President’s son-in-law may have sought a way to communicate with Russia via a back channel not monitored by you and your colleagues
  • During summer, you watch the President attend NATO summit and shove Montenegro PM, in an Interview claim Montenegro is aggressive, might start a war. This mirrors Russian propaganda & you know Russia backed covert operation destabilize Montenegrin election
  • For next year, either you, your colleagues and your organization, FBI, are discredited by President. He mixes true and false information in public disclosures which you are not allowed to respond to. If you do respond, your accused of leaking and could be fired or even jailed
  • Documents & information from confidential sources you’ve pledged to protect, are selectively leaked into public through those who are supposed to provide government oversight. These inappropriate disclosures make your job as an investigator nearly impossible & hurts your sources
  • At some point during the summer or before, you learn that the President’s son was receiving & responding to direct messages from website that was releasing emails stolen from the President’s opponent by Russia
  • 1st two years President’s term, you watch him take a negative, adversarial stance toward NATO and particularly Germany. This strains your relationship with your most valuable intel partners, your Counterterrorism agent colleagues depend on them & they help fight war on terror
  • Over next 2 years, President aggressively seeks meetings with Putin who helped elect him. Need for meetings is not clear. one President meets in private with Putin for 2 hours without witnesses but translator. To this day, you, your bosses don’t really know what was discussed
  • President emerges from private meeting with Putin and on world stage in Helsinki accepts and validates Russian denials about election interference & rejects years of your teams intel work. This badly damages your reputation and partner trust with your organization
  • Separately, your President publicly discusses a Russian proposed partnership on cyber security, this insane concept is mind boggling to you as an investigator as you’ve just spent years tracking these same Russians who just attacked your country
  • Even further, your President publicly mentions a possible exchange where Russian investigators might interview and interrogate you and other Americans about their attack on you and America. A crazy, frightening and bizarre threat to you as a civil servant.
  • Throughout your investigation into Russian interference, you watch as your President’s attacks on the Special Counsel, Justice Department & FBI are amplified and spread in America by the very Russian troll social media accounts and state sponsored propaganda you are investigating
  • Throughout the Special Counsel indictments, hearings and trials, you watch the President and his legal team publicly interject, discredit witnesses and discuss pardons, all subverting the rule of law and justice which you’ve dedicated your life to protect and defend
  • You either know or learn a parallel investigation shows Russians representing a bogus Russian gun rights movement penetrated the political party hosting members who’ve tried to discredit you - you recognize this as a TEXTBOOK espionage/influence op you learned at FBI academy
  • After two years, the Attorney General over you, who appropriately recused himself from Russia investigation, is fired for seemingly no clear reason after taking public lashings from the President
  • Your AG is replaced by an acting AG whose unqualified for position, has limited experience justify such high level appointment, you’ve watched him on TV discrediting your agency and your team’s investigation despite seeing none of evidence or knowing anything Russian influence
  • The same month, the President’s personal lawyer pleads guilty in federal court and says he continued negotiations throughout almost the entire Presidential campaign for a Tower in Moscow. This is in opposition to President’s public denials.
  • You read public reporting that the best apartment in the Moscow Tower project pursued by the President’s business was offered to Russia’s President Putin, the same Putin your President always sides with over you and your agency, the Putin who helped your President win
  • You either knew or learned through a redaction error that the President’s campaign manager was alleged to have lied about providing polling data to a Russian whom he owed money, via a former Russian GRU contact
/- Clint Watts
 

skelly

Member
Messages
201
Location
Birmingham
I just don’t see how a physical barrier that can be defeated in minutes will do any good. Seems like a tremendous waste of funds, manpower, labor, and materials. Not to mention the land will have to be taken or purchased from many private citizens. I don’t see that going well.
Problem is that opposition to the wall really means you’re ok with the current situation at the border most politicians democrat and republicans can be quoted as for a wall and for border integrity except when it comes to actually doing something then they’re opposed and won’t even come to the table to negotiate a solution. That’s the problem that we have with Trump he actually tries to do something. It that may all be a show too I mean he is still on office and still healthy...
 

Matt

Member
Messages
1,377
Location
Alabaster
Is it not ironic that the elites and establishment pols in the UK and United States are trying do undo the 2016 elections in the respective countries. Ignore the will of the people at your peril!
 

gangstonc

Member
Messages
1,794
Location
Meridianville
Problem is that opposition to the wall really means you’re ok with the current situation at the border most politicians democrat and republicans can be quoted as for a wall and for border integrity except when it comes to actually doing something then they’re opposed and won’t even come to the table to negotiate a solution. That’s the problem that we have with Trump he actually tries to do something. It that may all be a show too I mean he is still on office and still healthy...
Opposition to the wall in know way means what is going on at the border is acceptable. It just means you don’t think the wall will help the situation.
 

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